Capex is burning money, too, you just don't see it explicitly so you don't realize how much it affects your total cost of ownership.

Case in point, I bought my Citation V in Dec 2020 for $700K. I could have bought a Meridian for about $1.5M, costing $800K more.

If I put that $800K in an SP500 ETF, it would now be worth $1.36M, a gain of $556K. That's more money than I spent flying the Citation the last 3.5 years in total, so at this moment, my total cost of ownership for the Citation is LESS than the Meridian.

I've also enjoyed a substantial run up in market value of my plane, far more than the Meridian market moved, which means if I sell today, my TOC is *way* less than the Meridian. I might have flown my Citation V for free if I did that. This effect is less predictable than the stock market, but a lower cost airplane has more upside potential than a higher cost one.


That tactic means you lost the utility of the better airplane for several years.

I cannot afford to fly a PC-12 (~$3M capex) but I can afford to fly a Citation V. That's not exaggerating.

Mike C.

They look like this… WOT, 2300 (ish) RPM, 15.7 (ish) GPH. Typically right around 159 or 160 KIAS.

These numbers are off....1500 TIT is not peak anything on these engines, you're doing something wrong

14-15gph at 29.96/2500 is too low, you should be seeing 17gph

It seems you have a really good grasp on the older jet market.

An avenue I have not explored.

Im curious if you have any data on expenses related to your citation and hours before entering (insurance, annuals, programs if your engines are on them, and the cost for type rating/recurrent training?)
Perhaps not now, but an older jet may be the right decision for me to make (still evaluating)

Aerostar.... fits all the boxes.

Exactly. Older turbines, e.g. Citations, are cheap to buy BECAUSE they are expensive to own.

What is the operating budget for a PC12- one of the more expensive turboprops?

My only data point for turbine is from an older Meridian.
Annual is around $25-30 K and insurance is around the same $25 K (for a low time 400 hour pilot)

My hangar rent is around $6000 a year, would change minorly for a VLJ or turboprop.
Fuel on turboprops seems to come between $250-400 an hour (estimating 35-60 gallons at $6 /gal of Jetfuel), ($25,000-$40,000/year for 100 hours of fuel)

Is there something else I am missing?

Here’s another photo for you.

As you can see CHT’s range from 319 - 336 deg. F. EGT’s are not relevant but are in the 14xx range.

TIT which is most relevant is 1,551 deg F. which ranges from say 60 - 80 deg. F. LOP depending upon the cylinder (they vary a bit).

This is with an IO-550 (you may still have an IO-520).

This is with the TAT TN Whirlwind III with Rammer scoop and Beryl D’Shannon baffles.

You didn’t mention whether your TAS is knots or MPH but I hope it’s knots.

If I want to run 17.x GPH and 2500 RPM I’d fly even faster, but generally I cruise at the 2300 RPM numbers.

These are summer style (warm air) figures for my aircraft. In the winter when it’s much colder aloft the engine wants more FF to be appropriately LOP and as a result produces more power and higher speeds.

Here’s another photo for you.

As you can see CHT’s range from 319 - 336 deg. F. EGT’s are not relevant but are in the 14xx range.

TIT which is most relevant is 1,551 deg F. which ranges from say 60 - 80 deg. F. LOP depending upon the cylinder (they vary a bit).

This is with an IO-550 (you may still have an IO-520).

This is with the TAT TN Whirlwind III with Rammer scoop and Beryl D’Shannon baffles.

You didn’t mention whether your TAS is knots or MPH but I hope it’s knots.

If I want to run 17.x GPH and 2500 RPM I’d fly even faster, but generally I cruise at the 2300 RPM numbers.

These are summer style (warm air) figures for my aircraft. In the winter when it’s much colder aloft the engine wants more FF to be appropriately LOP and as a result produces more power and higher speeds.

These threads are fun to read. I remember starting the exact same process 10 years ago. One by one, I eliminated model after model and ended up with a Mustang. A TN Bonanza is hard to improve on in many ways.

Agree. I envy you guys that don't need 6+ seats and 200 lb baggage capacity. You have so many good options for your mission.

Kodiak
Similar fuel cost
Similar insurance cost
Similar maintenance cost
Similar speed
Two times people payload
Two + times the purchase price
Two + times the fun
1/2 the runway needed to operate

I would be grateful to hear from Tradewinds turbine Bonanza pilots who can give me some numbers on landing and takeoff distances. We’re looking at one for short grass field, 1400 feet, Sea level airport, with trees on one end. what are your experiences at different weights.? Thanks in advance

Mine got off the ground pretty quick and it stops quicker. I probably wouldn’t go crazy with Beta/reverse to slow down with FOD potential on that strip but it shouldn’t be a problem. What plane are you looking at? Feel free to DM me.

I moved from a TN Bonanza to a TBM and never looked back. They fly similiar.