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 Post subject: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 00:10 
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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 04:55 
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The Navy used to have Enlisted pilots fly real planes.

They were called Naval Aviation Pilots vs Naval Aviators on the officer side.

USAF. Late to the party again.

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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 05:28 
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Warrant officers have been flying helicopters since they were invented. Even though above the senior most enlisted, they are not a commissioned officer. Personal in this day and time it will be ones computer skills and hand eye coordination that enable them to fly a UA, not their rank or pay grade.


Last edited on 18 Dec 2015, 05:33, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 05:31 
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Sargeant pilots USAAF WWII. Also, seem to recall reading or hearing that the USN also had something similar during the same time.


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 05:40 
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Technically W-2 and above are commissioned officers.

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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 14:13 
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Bob Hoover and Chuck Yeager both started as flying sergeants.


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 14:20 
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Probably a good thing for the officer corps frankly


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 18 Dec 2015, 20:12 
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There I was, bobbing around Escambia Bay in my little liferaft waiting for a helo to come pull me out and end a water survival exercise and all of a sudden, here comes an SNB Bugsmasher (Beech 18) at <20 feet above the water buzzing the fleet. I didn't bail out of my raft but a few other guys did. He made about three passes like that that day and I later learned the pilot was the last Enlisted APC (Aviation Pilot Chief) in the Navy. I guess he figured no one was going to yank his wings a year short of retirement.


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 21 Dec 2015, 12:58 
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This can work for the RQ-4 because of the control interface and its lack of tactical relevance. The RQ-4 is used liked a satellite and enlisted personnel already "fly" satellites. For the tactical RPAs (MQ1 and MQ9) for example it is smarter for the Air Force to maintain officer pilots to fly those platforms. Now, I am not saying that enlisted pilots would not be capable of flying those platforms, but the responsibility and decision processes that are required to levy the full capabilities of the MQ1/9 require an officer in the seat. Talk to most enlisted sensor operators and although they would love to fly the aircraft, a large majority state that its not worth it to step over to the left seat as an enlisted person. Their argument is you are going to force me to make pilot type decisions, and take on the PIC responsibility of the mission for half the pay, no thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 24 Dec 2015, 01:25 
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Username Protected wrote:
Warrant officers have been flying helicopters since they were invented. Even though above the senior most enlisted, they are not a commissioned officer. Personal in this day and time it will be ones computer skills and hand eye coordination that enable them to fly a UA, not their rank or pay grade.

Need to check your facts. Upon promotion to CW2 Warrant Officers are Commisioned. Not technically Commisioned, kind of Commisioned, but Commisioned. A Commisioned warrant officer can do anything a 0-1 to 0-10 can do, command units, convene courts martial, etc, etc.

The warrant officer was not an enlisted pilot.

Touchy about this? Yes, yes I am. 23 years as a Warrant officer. Really ticked off LTC' s when I would get better quarters than them in Iraq.


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 24 Dec 2015, 18:57 
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Username Protected wrote:
Warrant officers have been flying helicopters since they were invented. Even though above the senior most enlisted, they are not a commissioned officer. Personal in this day and time it will be ones computer skills and hand eye coordination that enable them to fly a UA, not their rank or pay grade.

Need to check your facts. Upon promotion to CW2 Warrant Officers are Commisioned. Not technically Commisioned, kind of Commisioned, but Commisioned. A Commisioned warrant officer can do anything a 0-1 to 0-10 can do, command units, convene courts martial, etc, etc.

The warrant officer was not an enlisted pilot.

Touchy about this? Yes, yes I am. 23 years as a Warrant officer. Really ticked off LTC' s when I would get better quarters than them in Iraq.


As an officer in the Navy I had the utmost respect for Warrant officers. I obviously should have never made the post I did. It was a technicality response, and I was mistaken, to another post. I never meant to offend anybody.

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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 24 Dec 2015, 23:05 
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Username Protected wrote:

As an officer in the Navy I had the utmost respect for Warrant officers. I obviously should have never made the post I did. It was a technicality response, and I was mistaken, to another post. I never meant to offend anybody.




No personal offense taken David. I just hated the days early in my career when an AF pilot at the OClub at Incerlik AB said "aren't you something like an E-4 with a club card?"

The Warrant Officer is very misunderstood. Just ask any AF enlisted man. They have no idea what warrants are as the AF eliminated warrant officers years ago.

I didn't have to defend the Warrant Officer Corps that night. My O-6 Brigade commander did it for us. Needless to say the squirmy C-130 pilot linked away.

By the way the Navy has flying warrant officers again also.


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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 24 Dec 2015, 23:16 
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Actually, we are getting rid of flying warrants again. At least as of last month we were.

I think they are all being made O-3s at four years commissioned service and there was some way to deal with the more senior ones.

I have no warrants in my squadron so I didn't look very close at the plan.

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 Post subject: Re: USAF to Have Enlisted Pilots Fly UAS's
PostPosted: 24 Dec 2015, 23:23 
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Actually, we are getting rid of flying warrants again. At least as of last month we were.

I think they are all being made O-3s at four years commissioned service and there was some way to deal with the more senior ones.

I have no warrants in my squadron so I didn't look very close at the plan.

So I guess the term should have been "had" :bugeye:

The army looked at converting all warrants to the O grades. Money changed that plan.
Plus the warrant officer just works better for the army. That way you have pilots that are pilots for 20+ years and do not leave the cockpit to do a staff position for several years at a time. Plus without warrant officers in the army you wouldn't have a group of guys finding the most efficient and easy way to do things. Army Captains re-invent the wheel every 18 months. It takes an aviation warrant to point out to the young O-3 that the wheel is still doing fine.


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