Yes, I'm concerned about it. Was gonna start a P180 thread but wasn't sure how much info I'd get here. Can't find much info anywhere.

+1.... It's jet with a pseudo airstair door, a G1000 with SVT and a GFC 700. It's a ton of airplane for the money and will be valuable for years.

A Mustang purchased for $1.5MM-$1.7MM will always be worth at least that much.

I have heard from multiple people who have transitioned to a jet that it is vastly superior in a qualitative and difficult to describe way. Basically they can fly all day and not feel tired - vibration, cabin pressure, dunno - but they all say they're willing to make transcontinental journeys that they would have dreaded in a turboprop. The jet's just a happier travelling machine ... so I'm told

I'm only pro Mustang because its a very inexpensive, new, G1000 jet. If it were any more expensive you'd have to go with the Phenom 100.

I've done coast to coast in the Pilatus and its just a long haul. The environment doesn't bother me.

There you go, you said it, ATC will never get you high enough, there is no way you will get 1150 nm range in the Mustang. Thats at FL410.
A friend of mine as one and he never gets 41000 ft as its too slow for a jet.

Talk to Thierry at Air Journey, whenever he does around the world tours with Mustangs and TBMs. The Mustangs had to do an extra stop for fuel will the TBMs go non stop and the TBMs had to carry the bagage for the Mustangs as they had no useful load.


NBAA IFR Range (100 nm alternate) (± 4%) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1,150 nm (2,130 km or 1,323 mi) (Maximum Takeoff Weight, Full Fuel, Optimal Climb
and Descent, Maximum Cruise Thrust at 41,000 feet)

That is one of the most ridiculous things I have read on this board. How do these OWT get spread around? Too slow?! Probably nonsense started by single turboprop guys! I file 400 or 410 for 80% of my flights and have- read this- never, ever, not once, been denied my requested altitude. Over 200 hours since December. California to NY and everything in between. (Which is the equivalent to 400 hours in a Baron- lots of flying ...)

However, it is true that there are a lot of variables which will greatly affect your range when it comes to a jet. If you are landing at a rural airport and can get a descent at your discretion to a visual approach, your range is much more than if you are flying into KATL with a crossing altitude of 8k feet at 90 miles out, with weather, an instrument approach, and the possibility of going missed. The first scenario you may be able to do 1200 miles. The second maybe 800. Big difference.

In terms of the Mustang, I used to dream about them. I mentioned this to the Cessna salesman a few years ago. His friend had one and let me sit in it when he was coming through town. It was awesome to sit there and dream.
A few interesting things he told me.
-- If flying between Washington DC and Boston, do not get a Mustang, get a turboprop or a Cessna Sovereign
-- The Mustang has a much lower workload than many turboprops in normal ops. But when sh** happens, it happens even faster.
-- The Mustang has more margin to make up for stupid pilots than most turboprops
-- The Mustang is a Cessna, be prepared for life limited parts and Cessna's attitude to price older planes out of the market
-- Insurance companies suck and do not understand owner flown turbines

When I asked why keep it then. His answer, nothing comes close to the speed, low cost and range for the majority of flights he does. He has partnerships in bigger planes for hauling others or going really far.

Tim

As long as this thread is headed into fantasy land, forget the Mustang. Think Premier 1A. This is Beechtalk after all. The ugliness of this airplane hides its true beauty. Proper .80M jet speed (thats 100 kts faster than the Mustang), will climb to FL410 not creep, a real avionics suite, Collins Proline 21, 1500nm range, waaay bigger cabin. Burn about 125 gph. Twice the airplane for less than twice the money.


WJC

Here's the eye opener if you haven't done the turbine ownership math. Most turbines have the advantage of being a business deduction, but depreciation can be a slippery slope with recapture.

Example...

Let's say you buy a nice, used TBM C2 for $1.5 million and fly it for 5 years @ 150 hrs./yr. At the end of the term, you sell it for $1.1 million after brokerage expenses, etc. You don't have any real surprises during your ownership except....maybe a hot section inspection. You use 5 year straight line depreciation along with the recapture at the end of the period.

If you add up every dollar (maintenance, fuel bills, insurance), put a cost on the use of the money, repay the IRS, and then count what's left. The 5 year memory would have a price tag of nearly $1,100,000.00, even though you took advantage of all the deductions. (For purposes of the calculation, I used an 85% expense, since it is not uncommon to have 15% personal use.)

Go to the bank and get a photo of $1.1 million all neatly stacked up. Hang that photo on the wall of your empty hangar next to the photo of the turbine you used to own!

We all know that aviation is expensive, you just can't blink too much if you really want to fly with turbine comfort.

That is one of the most ridiculous things I have read on this board. How do these OWT get spread around? Too slow?! Probably nonsense started by single turboprop guys! I file 400 or 410 for 80% of my flights and have- read this- never, ever, not once, been denied my requested altitude. Over 200 hours since December. California to NY and everything in between. (Which is the equivalent to 400 hours in a Baron- lots of flying ...)

However, it is true that there are a lot of variables which will greatly affect your range when it comes to a jet. If you are landing at a rural airport and can get a descent at your discretion to a visual approach, your range is much more than if you are flying into KATL with a crossing altitude of 8k feet at 90 miles out, with weather, an instrument approach, and the possibility of going missed. The first scenario you may be able to do 1200 miles. The second maybe 800. Big difference.

If what you say is true they wouldn't be so cheap.

Easy to find out JC. Just saying there are better aircraft out there that do more than the new popular models that everyone is fixated on. Lots of guys say I will never by the A model of anything. Premier 1A is the B model. Lots to like....except the pregnant guppy look of the thing.

WJC

Wes, I have researched this stuff to the Nth degree. I wanted a 1A so bad I could taste it. Spoke with many owners. They do not do what you claim. Not even close. If they did they'd hold their $6MM price tag.

You should delete that post unless you have direct experience with them.

My buddy manages flies and manages one in Luxembourg and these are his numbers.

What did these owners you talked to say about the aircraft that is so different from what I posted?

WJC

Hell, if that was the BT rule, you'd have a post count of about 12.