Perusing through controller tonight for giggles, I wandered over to the "yea, right" section and started looking at the Citation ISP's for 3-500K. I'm surprised these things aren't moving faster than they are.

Obviously, they're old, slow and shred through fuel- but I was thinking that for the price they'd still be a relatively good steal, no? Conklin has them running at $2,400/hr. The next step up would be a II (6-800K) and then whatever else.

For the acquisition cost being so low, you could peel off about 120 hours a year before the ISP's buy-in + variable cost would meet the next step up's initial cost.

Wouldn't an ISP be a perfect airplane for someone looking to go the jet route and using it as a "trainer" until you hit the cost for a faster/newer airplane?

Anyone know the deal with these older citations?

They are a great deal if you have an IA ticket and you are able to pencil-whip your own phase inspections .

I think I read about the glorified pre-flight phase inspection that occurs monthly for $800

I don't know, looking at these things it just seems like it'd be cheapest way for a guy to get his jet hours out of the way before moving into something else.

There I fixed it.

In addition to their poor fuel/mpg/payload equation, if anything falls off, the bills are still in jet territory.

If they fly a lot, they eat you with the fuel bill. If they dont fly a lot, they eat you with the ongoing inspection regimen.

They are a great deal if capital costs you money and if you have your own IA on staff who can keep the maintenance cost under control (by pencil-whipping the phase inspections and using parts stolen from the junkyard if something fails).

Since we are in hypothetical country.... Say you buy one of these "cheap" citations. You operate under part 91. Are you still required to do all these phase inspections?

R

What does this mean? In my experience, there are no "hours to get out of the way".

The trick to jet ownership is paying for it, not flying it. If you can afford to buy and operate, you can probably afford a CFI to teach you.

I've looked those older Citations also. The phase inspection process is mind numbing. I couldn't figure it out. I don't think the service centers understand it either. They just send a big bill and hope you don't know what they're talking about.

For twin turbojets and turboprops: yes.

Funny enough, a single turboprop can be operated with an annual only.

For twin turbojets and turboprops: yes.

Funny enough, a single turboprop can be operated with an annual only.

I dont think there is a requirement to do a 'phase inspection' program for a twin-jet, but you do have to adhere to whatever the manufacturer cooked up. The Phenom guys have smarted up and structured their inspection program in a way that it can be done on an annual basis, but what those inspections include is prescribed by the manufacturer.

For SE turboprops, the IA can technically just do an annual inspection with the minimums required by the FAA, he is not tied to a specific plan from pilatus. In reality, most PC12s and TBMs are maintained based on the manufacturers inspection plan to maintain resale value.

Yet another reason to own a single turboprop.

Citations? Pick a part any part and call to get a price. You'll find out quickly why Citations are so cheap to purchase.

I know of a Citation II in decent shape with good hours left on the motors. It sold for $225,000.00! I suppose you can buy one, run it ragged, and then bury it in your backyard when you're done.

If you're going to buy a cheap Citation, you're better off buying an extra one just for parts..

If you're going to buy a cheap Citation, you're better off buying an extra one just for parts..

The parts are not that bad. Much cheaper than the Eclipse, since you can usually call a dismantler and find a good serviceable used take off. The inspection program is not terrible either. If you manage the plane yourself, and are smart about it, they really aren't that bad. (I mean, don't go dropping it off at a Cessna factory service center and give them a blank check.)

The issue is the cost of the engines & lousy performance for the amount of fuel the burn. Those airplanes for $300k probably have 3400 hours on the engines, no RVSM ($$$$$ and without it burning lots more fuel), and are coming up on a Phase V.

I had a couple friends try to talk me into going on as a 1/3 partner on an old 501 SP before I found the Eclipse. The old Citations have a lot more room inside, but it the panels are antique and they burn 3-4 times the fuel. Fuel is by far my biggest expense already, so it just didn't make sense to me.