Bruce, yes Morris was a cowboy and unfortunately I found out too late with my Commander escapades, I was way too trusting. But I have always maintained my Aerostars with top Aerostar people, either Don Smith in Alabama or Security Aviation in HHR with lots of Aerostar experience, so I think you trying to imply that I only have shade tree mechanics in the past for that model is unfair.

I was not disparaging, I was merely pointing out that there is a huge difference in cost between maintaining an Aerostar with an expert in Alabama or doing it in CA - that was my only point. They're equally as good, but one will cost you less and that's just a fact. You seem to disagree and that's fine.

Back to regular programming - I'd love for some Superstar II owners to chime in with their maintenance experience and costs.

I don’t think there is a huge difference in cost at all. In fact it’s probably the opposite of what you are proposing. After all, what’s the cost when the plane doesn’t fly or tries to hurt you?. There is simply zero chance you have better value going to Alabama from CA to do cheap maintenance vs. Aerostar Aircraft or the people in Utah. It just doesn’t work like that. The experts aren’t there to overcharge you. They are there to do it right and eek out a living. They don’t have well regarded businesses by doing the wrong thing.

And Morris wasn’t just a cowboy, he was a criminal and he should have been *back* in jail long before he victimized you and others. I hope there are no equivalents to him in the Aerostar world but I can think of a couple who have some things in common with him.

Now you're the disparaging one. Are you suggesting Don Smith/AerostarWorld is not a good shop? That only Aerostar Aircraft is good enough and everything else is suspect?

BTW, I was not talking about AA at all, I was taking about a shop in CA. Aerostar Aircraft is in Idaho. I agree that they're great.

Now you're the disparaging one. Are you suggesting Don Smith/AerostarWorld is not a good shop? That only Aerostar Aircraft is good enough and everything else is suspect?

BTW, I was not talking about AA at all, I was taking about a shop in CA. Aerostar Aircraft is in Idaho. I agree that they're great.

Brother Adam,

If there’s anyone who ought to be convinced by now that quality specialists are worthwhile, I would think it would be you. You owned a turbine for many years that you could never fly or enjoy primarily due to Morris Kernick, a convicted aviation fraudster also reportedly responsible for the deaths of several due to his poor maintenance. Wasn’t even a mechanic. I recall you had a fuel leak because he drilled through a fuel bag to run a wire to the wingtip. And that was just one example of many.

I sold my Aerostar back to the original owner in part because I had to fly 1000 miles to Joel for an oil change. I would not trust anyone to maintain the plane who didn’t know the airframe intimately. Sadly, the local guy had a bunch of dead clients. No thanks.

So I am shocked you’d disparage a known quality Aerostar expert in this way. It makes no sense to me other than joining the usual piling on from certain jet owners on this forum. More than any other factor, including the type certificate holder in many cases, the specialists keep these types of planes viable and flying safely period. If you own one and don’t support them, you’re shooting yourself in the foot.

Of course anyone should agree that knowing and understanding your plane is smart. However, an hour or 2 for an oil change? I’m not sure where I got this, but I copied it and this is how I look at an Aerostar oil change. And while I’m mechanical, I don’t want to make time for this and I want a pro cleaning injectors, etc:

Oil Change Procedures

1. Order parts to have on hand - 18 quarts AeroShell 15-50, Champion oil filter CG48110-1 or Tempest AA48110-2, oil sample kit (Blackstone).
2. Run engine to warm up.
3. Remove top & bottom cowlings. Inspect for oil leaks & fuel staining (blue).
4. Lay down oil matt below engines to catch spills.
5. Attach hose and drain oil via quick drain. Container must hold 12 quarts each engine.
6. Take oil sample mid-stream & send to Blackstone Labs.
7. Remove, inspect & clean turbocharger wastegate actuator filter.
8. Remove, inspect & clean oil breather screen.
9. Check spark plug leads for chaffing and cuts.
10. Check deck reference air hose nipples and clamps for tightness.
11. Check magneto filter ground lines & primary lead. Torque alternator lead nuts & check belt.
12. Check fuel pump, lines and injector lines for leaks & stains. Check air box door.
13. Check propeller deice leads for cable ties. Check spinner for loose bolts and cracks.
14. Check brake reservoir in avionics bay for fluid level. Add hydraulic fluid (5606) if necessary.
15. Bleed hydraulic pressure with flap handle. Look for accumulator drop around 400 - 500 psi. Manually push flaps all the way up. Check hydraulic fluid reservoir aft of baggage compartment. Add hydraulic fluid (5606) if necessary.
16. Check tire pressures (NLG-45 psi, MLG – 70 psi).
17. Check brake pads for wear (wear indicator or .10” min.).
18. Clean and lube flap tracks (AeroShell Grease 33)
19. Slide element (diaper, rags, etc.) under oil filter to catch oil.
20. Remove, drain, cut open & inspect oil filter element for metal.
21. Label oil filters with date and hobbs time. Put Dow DC-4 on filter gasket.
22. Install new oil filters. Torque to 20-25 ft-lbs or ¾ turn past contact with gasket.
23. Safety wire with .032 stainless steel.
24. Check exhaust pipes, turbo brackets, hoses, firewall, temperature probe leads, etc. for movement or discoloration.
25. Check Turbo mounting brackets for cracks or breaks.
26. Check Turbo mounting bracket front mount and nut for tightness.
27. Check wastegate linkage & pillow blocks for proper alignment & function.
28. Remove tubes and close quick drains. Add 9 quarts oil per side plus CamGuard (if used).
29. Put rags under engine and clean with brake cleaner or solvent and wipe dry.
30. Clean inside & outside of cowlings, as necessary.
31. Clean wastegate bearings with Berrymans followed by Loctite nickel anti-seize. Do not use on other bearings. Lubricate them with Mouse Milk, LPS or other quality lubricant.
32. Install top cowling.
33. Run engine with attention to oil pressure and oil on ground. Shutdown. Remove cowling.
34. Check for leaks (oil filter, valve covers, oil/fuel lines, accessory gaskets, front crankshaft seal, etc.). Fix where possible & note where not.
35. Replace top & bottom cowlings.
36. Reset Oil Change Scheduler on Garmin 430W to 25 hours.
37. Properly dispose of old oil.
38. Add oil change entry to Engine log (see example below).

Of course anyone should agree that knowing and understanding your plane is smart. However, an hour or 2 for an oil change? I’m not sure where I got this, but I copied it and this is how I look at an Aerostar oil change. And while I’m mechanical, I don’t want to make time for this and I want a pro cleaning injectors, etc:

Oil Change Procedures

1. Order parts to have on hand - 18 quarts AeroShell 15-50, Champion oil filter CG48110-1 or Tempest AA48110-2, oil sample kit (Blackstone).
2. Run engine to warm up.
3. Remove top & bottom cowlings. Inspect for oil leaks & fuel staining (blue).
4. Lay down oil matt below engines to catch spills.
5. Attach hose and drain oil via quick drain. Container must hold 12 quarts each engine.
6. Take oil sample mid-stream & send to Blackstone Labs.
7. Remove, inspect & clean turbocharger wastegate actuator filter.
8. Remove, inspect & clean oil breather screen.
9. Check spark plug leads for chaffing and cuts.
10. Check deck reference air hose nipples and clamps for tightness.
11. Check magneto filter ground lines & primary lead. Torque alternator lead nuts & check belt.
12. Check fuel pump, lines and injector lines for leaks & stains. Check air box door.
13. Check propeller deice leads for cable ties. Check spinner for loose bolts and cracks.
14. Check brake reservoir in avionics bay for fluid level. Add hydraulic fluid (5606) if necessary.
15. Bleed hydraulic pressure with flap handle. Look for accumulator drop around 400 - 500 psi. Manually push flaps all the way up. Check hydraulic fluid reservoir aft of baggage compartment. Add hydraulic fluid (5606) if necessary.
16. Check tire pressures (NLG-45 psi, MLG – 70 psi).
17. Check brake pads for wear (wear indicator or .10” min.).
18. Clean and lube flap tracks (AeroShell Grease 33)
19. Slide element (diaper, rags, etc.) under oil filter to catch oil.
20. Remove, drain, cut open & inspect oil filter element for metal.
21. Label oil filters with date and hobbs time. Put Dow DC-4 on filter gasket.
22. Install new oil filters. Torque to 20-25 ft-lbs or ¾ turn past contact with gasket.
23. Safety wire with .032 stainless steel.
24. Check exhaust pipes, turbo brackets, hoses, firewall, temperature probe leads, etc. for movement or discoloration.
25. Check Turbo mounting brackets for cracks or breaks.
26. Check Turbo mounting bracket front mount and nut for tightness.
27. Check wastegate linkage & pillow blocks for proper alignment & function.
28. Remove tubes and close quick drains. Add 9 quarts oil per side plus CamGuard (if used).
29. Put rags under engine and clean with brake cleaner or solvent and wipe dry.
30. Clean inside & outside of cowlings, as necessary.
31. Clean wastegate bearings with Berrymans followed by Loctite nickel anti-seize. Do not use on other bearings. Lubricate them with Mouse Milk, LPS or other quality lubricant.
32. Install top cowling.
33. Run engine with attention to oil pressure and oil on ground. Shutdown. Remove cowling.
34. Check for leaks (oil filter, valve covers, oil/fuel lines, accessory gaskets, front crankshaft seal, etc.). Fix where possible & note where not.
35. Replace top & bottom cowlings.
36. Reset Oil Change Scheduler on Garmin 430W to 25 hours.
37. Properly dispose of old oil.
38. Add oil change entry to Engine log (see example below).

Agreed it’s more than an oil change but I found a lot of stuff over time trying to do this and the plane never let me down or ran rough.

And you hit it. I’d rather clean guns than injectors and I’d rather be pulling fuel injectors out of a Coyote than an IO540. Not sure what it is but I prefer doing my own diesel oil changes on the F450 vs. doing the plane. I’ve got that down to 30 minutes. Just my personal state of mind these days. If you haven’t participated in cleaning 2pc injectors and all associated, it’s very educational to do.

I get it! I'm the same but opposite! I hate working on cars and won't touch them outside of an emergency but can't get enough of wrenching on planes.

Bruce's list is pretty close to the one that I used when I owned an Aerostar.

Adam,
I can only speak for one of my own Aerostars, one of which is a SS II, and while no one can deny that there is a lot of components crammed into a small area, I personally don’t seem to have any issues with anything getting too hot or getting heat damage. With that being said, my aircraft has had the cables relocated by Machen and everything else behind the engines is for the most part wrapped in that orange heat shield or coated with high temp orange RTV. The engine mounts are wrapped in stainless shielding in a lot of places. That was all done before I acquired the aircraft. When we have worked on a system that required compromising these heat protection measures, we have restored the protections that existed with only ONE exception. I had a TIT probe go bad. When I replaced it I had someone waiting on me to go somewhere so I basically just temporarily strung the wire for the probe up the side of the engine bay and across the top of the engine mount to the connectors. I can say that in 12 hours of flight it didn’t appear to have any effect on the wire. It was still the same as it was before, but I did ultimately take a couple of hours and re-route it the way it previously was routed, “just in case”.
I am not sure how many aircraft were actually ever converted to SS II’s by Machen, as Machen never officially released those exact figures, some say only 30 aircraft were converted and others say as many as 40. Someone that I know, who should be in the know, says that there were 42 converted. My point is, most everyone that has an opinion of the over heat issue is just repeating what they heard someone else say. With the limited number ever produced and the limited number still flying, how many people have really ever owned, flown and maintained one. I personally think it’s like the Mooney-Itis disease, primarily, the only people that talk smack about a Mooney is someone that has never owned one. The Aerostar community definitely has a few Aerostar Gurus. And I have to agree that at least two, maybe even three of them I also hold in that regard. But there is also a couple, maybe three that even a blind man can see are only self proclaimed experts but they have proclaimed it so long that they have a lot of other people proclaiming it … you know how that goes. “strong marketing” dept. I have seen Mooney Owners, Beechcraft owners as well as Aerostar owners who have fallen prey to the proclaimed “ Brand Specific Mechanic-Gods … and while there are definitely many benefits to being loyal or specializing in one particular make of aircraft to be an expert on I still feel, just my opinion, that pretty much any good A&P, whom understands the particular systems of an aircraft, and has the proper documentation ie; proper manuals, should be able to diagnose and repair just about any issue that would come up on a piston powered light twin aircraft. Obviously the more experience and the the more familiar they are with a system the more efficient they will be in making a repair. I know that at least two of the BIG name Aerostar shops seem to go out of their way to throw you a life line via telephone whenever you need one. As in they have “been there and done that” many times. I personally don’t see any reason why I would ever back away from buying another SS II. I know a couple of past Aerostar owners who owned multiple SS II’s and that’s all that they wanted. I was flying with a friend just yesterday and he said “Come on show me that speed I hear about”, so I went well above my normal 65% power setting and he said “Da@n, this thing is faster than my MU2. Granted, we were at 5,500 ft, but if it will even come close to those book numbers it shows for 25,000 ft, what other airplane can you buy for under $500K that even starts to compare. The info in the attached photo is taken from an old Machen advertisement, I think from the late 70’s. Those MPH vs knots always look a little more impressive.

Now you're the disparaging one. Are you suggesting Don Smith/AerostarWorld is not a good shop? That only Aerostar Aircraft is good enough and everything else is suspect?

BTW, I was not talking about AA at all, I was taking about a shop in CA. Aerostar Aircraft is in Idaho. I agree that they're great.

There were at least 26 converted that I have in my database. 42 sounds high to me. Low to mid 30's would be my bet.

Looks like 11 of them have been flown at least once in the last year from what I can tell. Only a few of them are flying anywhere near regularly.