24 May 2025, 17:43 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 01 Feb 2025, 20:54 |
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Joined: 01/22/19 Posts: 1094 Post Likes: +854 Location: KPMP
Aircraft: PA23-250
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Username Protected wrote: We’re at the inflection point now where the limited number of airframes/parts/services is on the wrong side of the curve. There’s no excess capacity, so the price on the remaining will spiral up based on the capacity of the very wealthy to pay, and that shows no sign of abating any time soon. A new 182 in 1980 was $185K. Today that is $750K once you adjust for inflation. That was 45 years ago! A new 182 right now lists for about $650K, actually LESS than they did back in 1980 once you correct for inflation. There are more ways to get into aviation inexpensively today than ever before such as LSAs, kits, homebuilt aircraft, and new smaller designs. Mike C.
You're off a bit. A new 182 was $46k in 1980, which is $186k today using the CPI.
So a new 182 today, at $650k, costs more than three times what it should be worth.
_________________ A&P/IA/CFI/avionics tech KPMP Cirrus aircraft expert
Last edited on 01 Feb 2025, 23:19, edited 1 time in total.
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 01 Feb 2025, 21:32 |
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Joined: 01/06/08 Posts: 5129 Post Likes: +2961
Aircraft: B55 P2
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Username Protected wrote: And it’s only going to get worse I have a simple, quick, effective way to reduce maintenance expenses, reduce maintenance risks, reduce downtime, and ease the overload at the shops. Increase the "annual" inspection interval to 2 years.(snip) Mike C.
At least for me, annual inspections are a small part of the maintenance costs.
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 01 Feb 2025, 23:48 |
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Joined: 10/06/17 Posts: 3209 Post Likes: +2696 Location: san diego
Aircraft: G35 / Acroduster
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The problem is we are not producing new mechanics and if we are, they are not staying in the business. Shops are pulling peeps off the street who have some mechanical ability bc they have no other choice and are trying to keep the wrenches swinging but it isn’t working and it never will work. Being an aircraft mechanic is a very specialized skill that takes years and years to learn and become good at. Being an aircraft mechanic is something to be proud of and society should recognize and reward that. As my aircraft mechanic buddy says…”Aircraft Maintenance used to be a Religion”.
If what I’ve said above is true, how could it not get worse? Worse before it gets better is about the best to hope for at this point and Glenn has some suggestions. The root problem is not being addressed in any meaningful way that I know of, so my advice is if you like flying your own airplane get out there and start learning everything you can about aircraft maintenance. Join the fight.
_________________ A&P / IA G-35
Last edited on 01 Feb 2025, 23:49, edited 1 time in total.
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 01 Feb 2025, 23:48 |
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Joined: 12/03/14 Posts: 20080 Post Likes: +25196 Company: Ciholas, Inc Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
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Username Protected wrote: You're off a bit. A new 182 was $46k in 1980, which is $186k today using the CPI. Source? I tried to find a good price and must have missed badly. Mike C.
_________________ Email mikec (at) ciholas.com
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 02 Feb 2025, 00:23 |
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Joined: 01/22/19 Posts: 1094 Post Likes: +854 Location: KPMP
Aircraft: PA23-250
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Username Protected wrote: You're off a bit. A new 182 was $46k in 1980, which is $186k today using the CPI. Source? I tried to find a good price and must have missed badly. Mike C.
https://cessna.org/wp-content/uploads/2 ... hist-1.pdf
_________________ A&P/IA/CFI/avionics tech KPMP Cirrus aircraft expert
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 02 Feb 2025, 02:02 |
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Joined: 12/03/14 Posts: 20080 Post Likes: +25196 Company: Ciholas, Inc Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
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Username Protected wrote: https://cessna.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/182hist-1.pdf Thanks, my post was edited to remove my bad data. Mike C.
_________________ Email mikec (at) ciholas.com
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 03 Feb 2025, 21:12 |
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Joined: 11/15/17 Posts: 1072 Post Likes: +551 Company: Cessna (retired)
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Username Protected wrote: 45 hours for a Cessna 426 annual checklist seems really light. Mooneys are 29 hours and bonanzas are 32. Usually more What is a Cessna 426? A modified 425?
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 03 Feb 2025, 23:00 |
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Joined: 12/03/14 Posts: 20080 Post Likes: +25196 Company: Ciholas, Inc Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
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Username Protected wrote: What is a Cessna 426? The Cessna 426 program was a secret development project using two Cessna 213 aircraft bolted together. Look up Cessna 620 (double 310) for an example of this development technique employed at Cessna. Mike C.
_________________ Email mikec (at) ciholas.com
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 04 Feb 2025, 00:30 |
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Joined: 11/15/17 Posts: 1072 Post Likes: +551 Company: Cessna (retired)
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Username Protected wrote: What is a Cessna 426? The Cessna 426 program was a secret development project using two Cessna 213 aircraft bolted together. Look up Cessna 620 (double 310) for an example of this development technique employed at Cessna. Mike C.
I worked on several secret development programs, but this one must have been so secret that I missed it.
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 04 Feb 2025, 23:30 |
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Joined: 05/06/14 Posts: 255 Post Likes: +772 Location: 7KS9
Aircraft: C140, PA24-260C
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Username Protected wrote: Sorry folks the 426 was a test bed, it had a PT6 on one side and Garrett on the other. Cessna was testing both for performance.  The engine testbed for the CX was the 650 E2 Prototype. TFE731 on one side and the AE3007C on the other, so Garrett and RR/Allison on the same airplane. The nacelle of the Rolls is about the size of a Mustang cabin, so it was quite the sight. Bill and I both did extensive work on the CX program. And yes, the Rolls is a true British engine, and turns the other way.... Phil
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 05 Feb 2025, 19:20 |
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Joined: 11/15/17 Posts: 1072 Post Likes: +551 Company: Cessna (retired)
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We nicknamed the Allison/650 testbed "Bigfoot."
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Post subject: Re: Maintenance Posted: 05 Feb 2025, 23:15 |
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Joined: 10/06/17 Posts: 3209 Post Likes: +2696 Location: san diego
Aircraft: G35 / Acroduster
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Username Protected wrote: I'm working on the problem from the home front. I'm sending my son to Utah State University for Aviation Mtc Management Program w A&P. These kids are offered good jobs well before they graduate and have summer jobs waiting. AI won't replace maintainers. That is awesome, James. He will thank you for that, I have no doubt! Peeps that haven’t been thru a good A&P program don’t understand or appreciate how much knowledge and understanding of all things mechanical one develops there. Those skills are going to be golden, and in short order.
_________________ A&P / IA G-35
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