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12 May 2025, 13:42 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 05:48 
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Joined: 09/06/11
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Company: METARmaps.com
Location: (KIWS) Houston, TX
Aircraft: M35
Username Protected wrote:
My guess and I’d be concerned too if it were my business, but he’s using a a small computer that has removable data cards from what I can tell, and it also connects to your wireless network. That could be a big issue if someone were to say put a virus on it that could backdoor someone’s network if resold.


Make sure the METAR Map computer goes on a public WiFi network and you won't have to worry about this. Most modern WiFi access point / routers have a guest network feature. Once enabled, the guest network is separate from your business network.

--paul

What rabbit hole are you guys going down? METARmaps are microcontroller based (no SD Card) and query a secure (yeah, I know) server in the cloud using an industry standard encryption protocol to communicate.
_________________
Blue... Tail... well, you know...

Richard
N9831R

https://metarmaps.com


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 05:49 
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Company: METARmaps.com
Location: (KIWS) Houston, TX
Aircraft: M35
Additionally on the map side of things, there are several layers of security here too.

It connects to your network using your *secure* password which is entered using a temporary webservice on the microcontroller which immediately closes once a network connection has been established and can not be re-opened unless there is physical button pushing. So there is no open "hole" in the network. Communication between the map and our servers uses an industry-standard 128-bit encryption.

METARmaps run on firmware instead of software to operate. Firmware can only be hacked if it can be accessed directly (it's not) and the source code is available to the hacker. All hacks we hear about are software related.

Proly TMI

_________________
Blue... Tail... well, you know...

Richard
N9831R

https://metarmaps.com


Last edited on 10 Jan 2023, 17:46, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 08:25 
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Joined: 01/25/20
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Username Protected wrote:
One day, I'm going to break out the Raspberry and the LEDs and try to finish this one with about 150 airports and counting.


Nice! Must be a bear to frame ;-)


it had it's challenges. Though i'm finding the leds and the setup to be a slowdown.

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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 15:59 
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Joined: 04/17/19
Posts: 392
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Location: KMMU - New Jersey
Aircraft: Piper Aztec
Username Protected wrote:
it had it's challenges. Though i'm finding the leds and the setup to be a slowdown.


I agree LEDs are the issue, you can find the large ones that are water proof and they work ok, but I'd rather have used a much smaller LED. In my case I found somebody selling the typical string of ws2811 LEDs that were not waterproof (IP67) this allowed me to save some space along the back as they weren't as long and I could lay the LED electronics flat against the board. I could have used the LED "strips" but the amount of soldering to place the LEDs were I wanted them made that route unrealistic.

After I wrapped my head around how to tackle the project I did it in an evening with the aid of my wife. We punched the holes for the LEDs (sharpened thin wall brass tubing and put it in a drill) then figured out the best way to route the wiring. I suggest you write down the LED "number" along with the weather station/airport as you place the LEDs into the map.

My unit is controlled by an Arduino not a Raspberry Pi, but the results are the same. I am still without a frame, one of these days I'll make a frame, or find something at a store. For the map itself, I pulled the WAC chart from the FAA website (the WAC hasn't been updated in years) cropped it to my desired size and sent it to FedEx office (formally Kinko's) to be printed.

All in all it was a fun project, I won't say overly hard, but it was tedious at times and I was obviously learning as I went, would I do another one? For myself yes, but for somebody else? Nope!

Richard can keep his side business, I'm not going to compete!

Jeff

Attachment:
map.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 16:46 
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Joined: 08/05/16
Posts: 3137
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Company: Tack Mobile
Location: KBJC
Aircraft: C441
Username Protected wrote:
Additionally on the map side of things, there are several layers of security here too.

It connects to your network using your *secure* password which is entered using a temporary webservice on the microcontroller which immediately closes once a network connection has been established and can not be re-opened unless there is physical button pushing. So there is no open "hole" in the network.

METARmaps use firmware instead of software to operate. Firmware can only be hacked if it can be accessed directly (it's not) and the source code is available to the hacker. All hacks we hear about are software related.

Proly TMI


Are you using a Pi Pico? That's cool.


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 16:48 
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Joined: 08/05/16
Posts: 3137
Post Likes: +2282
Company: Tack Mobile
Location: KBJC
Aircraft: C441
Username Protected wrote:
Additionally on the map side of things, there are several layers of security here too.

It connects to your network using your *secure* password which is entered using a temporary webservice on the microcontroller which immediately closes once a network connection has been established and can not be re-opened unless there is physical button pushing. So there is no open "hole" in the network.

METARmaps use firmware instead of software to operate. Firmware can only be hacked if it can be accessed directly (it's not) and the source code is available to the hacker. All hacks we hear about are software related.

Proly TMI


Are you using a Pi Pico? That's cool.


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 17:49 
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Joined: 09/06/11
Posts: 336
Post Likes: +34
Company: METARmaps.com
Location: (KIWS) Houston, TX
Aircraft: M35
Are you using a Pi Pico? That's cool.[/quote]

No, too many roadblocks doing business at scale with the Raspberry Pi Foundation....

_________________
Blue... Tail... well, you know...

Richard
N9831R

https://metarmaps.com


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 10 Jan 2023, 21:29 
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Joined: 01/24/19
Posts: 968
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Company: Bullard Aviation Services, Inc
Location: Ormond Beach, FL (KOMN)
Aircraft: 1978 Bonanza A36
Username Protected wrote:
it had it's challenges. Though i'm finding the leds and the setup to be a slowdown.


I agree LEDs are the issue, you can find the large ones that are water proof and they work ok, but I'd rather have used a much smaller LED. In my case I found somebody selling the typical string of ws2811 LEDs that were not waterproof (IP67) this allowed me to save some space along the back as they weren't as long and I could lay the LED electronics flat against the board. I could have used the LED "strips" but the amount of soldering to place the LEDs were I wanted them made that route unrealistic.

After I wrapped my head around how to tackle the project I did it in an evening with the aid of my wife. We punched the holes for the LEDs (sharpened thin wall brass tubing and put it in a drill) then figured out the best way to route the wiring. I suggest you write down the LED "number" along with the weather station/airport as you place the LEDs into the map.

My unit is controlled by an Arduino not a Raspberry Pi, but the results are the same. I am still without a frame, one of these days I'll make a frame, or find something at a store. For the map itself, I pulled the WAC chart from the FAA website (the WAC hasn't been updated in years) cropped it to my desired size and sent it to FedEx office (formally Kinko's) to be printed.

All in all it was a fun project, I won't say overly hard, but it was tedious at times and I was obviously learning as I went, would I do another one? For myself yes, but for somebody else? Nope!

Richard can keep his side business, I'm not going to compete!

Jeff

Attachment:
map.jpg


Jeff,
I think that this might be a little more than a side hustle for Richard.
When they have policies and “Doing business at scale” I think it’s a lot more than a garage workshop entrepreneurial venture .
At one time, “during the 22 worst years of my life” I had over 1,500 employees . I owned 100% of the stock in my business at the time, but any policy could be changed in an instant with the touch of the keyboard and a memo to the heads of each department.
_________________
Bullard Aviation Services, Inc.
www.BullardAviation.com


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 13 Jan 2023, 11:40 
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Joined: 07/01/11
Posts: 334
Post Likes: +132
Company: Mid-Coast Air Charter, Inc.
Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Aircraft: C-182, King Air 200
If the Map is still available to donate. There is an aviation-focused high school located at the Baton Rouge Airport, Helix Aviation Academy. I'm sure they would be grateful to have the map.

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Trae Welch
C-182, B200, and anything else someone will let me fly.


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 13 Jan 2023, 15:51 
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Joined: 07/09/09
Posts: 3656
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Company: Progress Technical. LLC
Location: Doylestown, PA (KDYL)
Aircraft: B-55
Username Protected wrote:
What rabbit hole are you guys going down? METARmaps are microcontroller based (no SD Card) and query a secure (yeah, I know) server in the cloud using an industry standard encryption protocol to communicate.


Quote:
METARmaps run on firmware instead of software to operate. Firmware can only be hacked if it can be accessed directly (it's not) and the source code is available to the hacker. All hacks we hear about are software related.


Richard, I'm not poking at you specifically. I think METAR Maps are great. I think I told you this as OSH.

Anyhow, firmware is software, it's just in ROM. The real attack comes from hacking the programs that put data in RAM -- in other words all programs. Think IP stack programs here.

Some of the biggest hacks in history have come about by attacking IOT devices -- air conditioning controllers, etc, etc. The uController that runs METAR maps is really an IOT device accessing the internet (albeit over an SSL encrypted link) to get XML data. Now, how about I hack the DNS system of the router you depend on and have your METAR Maps computer go to myWeather.bad ? I feed your uController bad data until the stack on the IP transport system goes belly up. Of course, I've polluted the stack in your machine to execute arbitrary code -- my code and I've now got control of your device. This is the classic stack overflow.

Scary huh? This is just one type of attack. This is what keeps sys admins up at night.

Again, not to poke at you specifically. If one of these maps showed up at my company, we would make sure it was on a publicly accessible, or low security, WiFi.

--paul


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 15 Jan 2023, 15:32 
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Joined: 09/06/11
Posts: 336
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Company: METARmaps.com
Location: (KIWS) Houston, TX
Aircraft: M35
Username Protected wrote:

Quote:
METARmaps run on firmware instead of software to operate. Firmware can only be hacked if it can be accessed directly (it's not) and the source code is available to the hacker. All hacks we hear about are software related.


Richard, I'm not poking at you specifically. I think METAR Maps are great. I think I told you this as OSH.

Anyhow, firmware is software, it's just in ROM. The real attack comes from hacking the programs that put data in RAM -- in other words all programs. Think IP stack programs here.

Some of the biggest hacks in history have come about by attacking IOT devices -- air conditioning controllers, etc, etc. The uController that runs METAR maps is really an IOT device accessing the internet (albeit over an SSL encrypted link) to get XML data. Now, how about I hack the DNS system of the router you depend on and have your METAR Maps computer go to myWeather.bad ? I feed your uController bad data until the stack on the IP transport system goes belly up. Of course, I've polluted the stack in your machine to execute arbitrary code -- my code and I've now got control of your device. This is the classic stack overflow.

Scary huh? This is just one type of attack. This is what keeps sys admins up at night.

Again, not to poke at you specifically. If one of these maps showed up at my company, we would make sure it was on a publicly accessible, or low security, WiFi.

--paul

Totally agree. Frankly, if the router were hacked, you've got bigger problems. Once inside the firewall, I'd go for juicier, easier targets - like workstations, servers or computers. Microsoft or Apple OS hacking procedures are well-documented and readily available on the DarkWeb and other hack sites.

At the end of the day, I agree that a Public or Guest Wi-Fi (restricted to web access only) is a fine solution and it's a sad state of affairs that such heightened security is required in today's world...

_________________
Blue... Tail... well, you know...

Richard
N9831R

https://metarmaps.com


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 15 Jan 2023, 17:55 
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Joined: 07/02/14
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Location: Lakeville, Minnesota (KLVN)
Aircraft: J35
If one were to write a METARmaps virus would
Would you make it do?

(We love ours Richard, thanks again)


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N340Q
J35

ASEL&MEL ASES CFII MEI Former BPPP Instructor


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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2023, 11:44 
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Joined: 09/06/11
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Company: METARmaps.com
Location: (KIWS) Houston, TX
Aircraft: M35
<DUPLICATE POST REMOVED>

_________________
Blue... Tail... well, you know...

Richard
N9831R

https://metarmaps.com


Last edited on 16 Feb 2023, 13:00, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: METARmaps - Issue from a couple of weeks ago
PostPosted: 16 Feb 2023, 11:54 
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Joined: 09/06/11
Posts: 336
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Company: METARmaps.com
Location: (KIWS) Houston, TX
Aircraft: M35
I'm happy to report that METARmaps - SOUTHEAST has found a home at the Florida Air Museum in Lakeland, Florida.

It will be displayed in their Science on a Sphere lab at the Skylab Innovation Center.

I'm proud to support the Aerospace Center for Excellence (ACE) in their mission to ENGAGE, EDUCATE and ACCELERATE the next generation of aerospace professionals.

Thank you all for your suggestions and comments.


Please login or Register for a free account via the link in the red bar above to download files.

_________________
Blue... Tail... well, you know...

Richard
N9831R

https://metarmaps.com


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