Hello!

I am ready to upgrade to an SETP after 2 years of Cirrus SR20 ownership and about 300 hours on this plane.

We are a group of 3 future owners, 2 pilots and one non-pilot and our budget is around 3.5, which means we could go for a brand new Piper M600 or a second hand (2013-2015) TBM900, but also an older PC12-NG.

I have been reading through two immensely helpful threads here on BT and I am currently setting up an excel sheet to compare the operating costs on the three airplanes. it looks like the TBM and the Pilatus are not too far apart while the M600, especially when bought new, will result in much lower operating costs. That could however be swallowed up by the higher loss in value during the first couple of years, being a new airplane...?

Would have any thoughts on buying new or second hand and also, for me as the "weak link" with only 1000 hours experience (300h on the SR20 and 100h on a Socata TB20), if we should even consider the PC12? Looks like the M600 and the TBM are fairy easy airplanes to step up to, but the PC12 looks way more complex.

I was thinking of joining the Owners groups, but I thought that I might get a more unbiased opinion here to begin with.

Regards,

Michael

Two questions:
What is your mission and can you get insurance?

If you plan to routinely take more than four then you need the Pilatus.

If you want it to maintain value: Pilatus > TBM > new M600.

The M600 will cost a lot less to fly in fuel, engine, and maintenance costs.

The TBM will be the fastest of the lot by quite a bit.

The PC12 will haul the most.

A 441 would cost less than half of all of them and do far more than any of them. Some are allergic to more than one engine, alas.

Mike C.

The M600 will cost a lot less to fly in fuel, engine, and maintenance costs.

The TBM will be the fastest of the lot by quite a bit.

The PC12 will haul the most.

A 441 would cost less than half of all of them and do far more than any of them. Some are allergic to more than one engine, alas.

Mike C.

Our mission is Central Europe, to the Mediterranean, for the longest trips about 700-800 miles max, with 2-3 adults and 2-3 children, I would say 800 pounds weight for all of us, plus light luggage. But that is not the routine. The routine would be one to two hour flights with 1-3 adults on board.

Insurance will be no problem here, my UK underwriter (Visicover) will cover the TBM without safety pilot, unfortunately they don't cover the M600 and the PC12 so they would require a safety pilot for the first 20-50 hours, which is not an issue because our second partner is an ATPL pilot.

I haven't considered the Conquest because the one with the biggest wallet in our team doesn't want an old or loud airplane, but maybe we could invest the money we save into new cockpit and interior...?

I think the priority is the lowest operating cost, speed is not that much of an issue, as long as we can make the 700 miles trip in no more than 3 hours. And since we don't have to count the cost of capital, I thought a brand new M600 might give us less worries about expensive gear actuators or Honeywell avionics problems.

Even with the warranty-insurance?

Somebody told me that Garmin avionics are designed by pilots while Honeywell is designed by engineers, but thats a different topic.

I think you might be best suited with a used Meridian which has a full new suite of Garmin avionics (G700 TXi, GTN TXi, etc).

You can pay for a lot of repairs and upgrades with the money saved on purchase cost.

The lighter weight also saves money with ATC fees in Europe.

Here's one already in France:

https://www.controller.com/listing/for- ... p-aircraft

You might also consider a JetProp conversion. They are already on Garmin's GFC 600 STC list.

Mike C.

Meridian is not reliable for 800 nm and is too small for all those adults at the same time.
Now if it's just the kids the Jet Prop is perfect!

It is hard to fathom that after 40 years nothing can fly as fast, haul all that stuff and get into short fields on so little fuel as a 441.

Filling six seats and going 800nm says Pilatus to me, if you’re talking SETP. Personally, it’s Mustang to me, but that’s not SETP.

I'm trying to make this make sense...

You are in different and better league than me--but a PC12 would be my choice by far if the opportunity presented. You might not get ALL the speed, but utility is off the charts.

The 425 and 441s---seem to be awesome choices and provide great utility and would be a delight. No experience with either---but wow---fun to think about it.

I'm trying to make this make sense...

This is THE question.

The M600/TBM/PC12 are very different airplanes for different missions. The only similarity is they all have one engine on the front.

6 people for 800nm in SETP will require a bathroom. One of those 6 will not be able to hold it.


You can’t beat the PC-12 for comfort and bathroom. Personally if I had that budget and needed to fly single pilot I would do the PC-12 or a lighter jet like the M2

I find anything over 2.5 hours with 4+ people will require a bathroom.

Mike