05 Nov 2025, 14:45 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 20:54 |
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Joined: 03/03/15 Posts: 40 Post Likes: +28 Location: KJGG
Aircraft: PA46-310P
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I'll second the TSIO-550 Malibu. Here the fuel range ring still shows over 800nm left after about 500-600nm. I'm showing 196KTS groundspeed with 3kts on the nose. I wasn't pushing it hard and was only at FL210 on a hot +25C std day. I also have a radar pod, so that costs a couple knots too.
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 21:59 |
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Performance wise its really hard to beat the 601P I have now.
The downside is in 286 hours I've owned it I have spent more than $500 hr on unscheduled maintenance. (More than 1/2 of this from an odd engine failure, lifter split in half and trashed the inside of the engine)
If I sell it for my reasonable market based asking price ($200K), not counting Fuel costs (fuel probably about $210/hr) It will have cost me more than $800/hr all in.
If I adjust for training and maintenance hours and include fuel total operating cost is around $1250 for used flight hour.
I paid cash for everything and I am computing my cost of money/capital at 0. Also I have no business need for this so it is all after tax $
It is getting close to needing a new engine on the right side, and could really use paint. So I could easily spend another $100K
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 22:08 |
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Joined: 05/05/09 Posts: 5299 Post Likes: +5292
Aircraft: C501, R66, A36
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Paul. I 100% believe if you survived flying an Aerostar you’d be fine in a Iv-p. I never had a single scary moment in mine. Solid 260kt airplane. My biggest problem with this and the Malibu is the garbage tsio-550. It’s a pile of crap for an engine and I genuinely don’t trust it. Best 200kt airplane I’ve owned is a Lycoming Harmon Rocket.
Mike 863-899-1617. Call or text me if you want to chat
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 22:14 |
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Joined: 06/17/14 Posts: 6010 Post Likes: +2745 Location: KJYO
Aircraft: C-182, GA-7
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The Aerostar I fly is $400/hr and I believe it is rented way under price and should be $600/hr easy. However, the owner has not had any major surprises from a $100k engine. Honestly, at $1,200/hr you are in KingAir territory as far as operating costs. Acquisition costs will be what takes you for a loop. Then again, the acquisition costs for an SR-22 are just about as eye watering.
Find a 175kt aircraft like an SR-22 and enjoy the (albeit slower) ride.
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 22:37 |
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Joined: 12/07/17 Posts: 6976 Post Likes: +5869 Company: Malco Power Design Location: KLVJ
Aircraft: 1976 Baron 58
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$1200 an hour should get you comfortably into an MU-2.
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 22:45 |
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Joined: 05/05/09 Posts: 5299 Post Likes: +5292
Aircraft: C501, R66, A36
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Username Protected wrote: $1200 an hour should get you comfortably into an MU-2. I’m in Mexico now with my MU-2 (50 years old). I think it’s closer to $500 an hour. Most reliable airplane I’ve ever owned.
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 23:10 |
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Joined: 06/28/09 Posts: 14423 Post Likes: +9555 Location: Walnut Creek, CA (KCCR)
Aircraft: 1962 Twin Bonanza
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Username Protected wrote: Velocity XL-RG with an IO-550.
I'm just at 200kts with an 1,100nm range. I know the TSIO550 Velocity's can make 200kts with no problem. I don't think you can beat ^^ for the mission as stated at the lowest cost. My choice would be a PII B55, although event at 200kts that mission is tough, 4 hrs min in a tight plane is a tough ask. I'd be looking at 250kts + if I was doing that on a consistent basis.
_________________ http://calipilot.com atp/cfii
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 23 Oct 2020, 23:45 |
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Joined: 08/14/13 Posts: 6410 Post Likes: +5147
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Username Protected wrote: Lancair ES-P, if you can find one for sale. Or a Lancair Super ES, you don’t need the -P and if you want four adults you’ll appreciate the greater useful load of the ES Ask me how I know
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 24 Oct 2020, 08:22 |
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Joined: 11/20/14 Posts: 6835 Post Likes: +5040
Aircraft: V35
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You had a lifter split in half, trashed an engine, and that’s going to push you into a single? Most people, that would convince them of a twin or a parachute.
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 24 Oct 2020, 09:38 |
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>You had a lifter split in half, trashed an engine, and that’s going to push you into a single? >Most people, that would convince them of a twin or a parachute.
The 601P has real high strung engines twin turbos , stealing bleed air for pressurization. In 286 hours I've landed with 2 engine failures. One the lifter, ran ok on 5 cylinders. The other a defect in a brand new cylinder that caused a blow torch to form around a spark plug helicoil that was loose and blowtorch the cht sensor making me think I had a fire. In both cases in a single would have made it to an airport.
Below 500 ft on takeoff I'd much rather have an engine failure in a single. Above 500ft a BRS parachute starts to make sense.
A single would change some of my behavior, I'd be less likely to invite others on some trips.
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 24 Oct 2020, 10:14 |
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Joined: 07/11/14 Posts: 1469 Post Likes: +422 Location: 46U
Aircraft: C182, Lancair IV-P
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Username Protected wrote: I haven't read all the way through, but I assume someone mentioned the Mooney Ovation with the funky two bladed "pressure prop" that had the blade extensions designed to force more air in the intake. That machine had a true airspeed of nearly 195 kts down low. I believe it is/was the fastest normally aspirated certified piston single production aircraft ever built. I went on a demo flight in one of these — most impressive! Best, Tom
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Post subject: Re: Lowest op cost plane for 4 ppl 200knot, 800nm, no O2 Posted: 24 Oct 2020, 12:36 |
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Joined: 04/29/13 Posts: 774 Post Likes: +547
Aircraft: C177RG, ATOS-VR
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Username Protected wrote: $1200 an hour should get you comfortably into an MU-2. I’m in Mexico now with my MU-2 (50 years old). I think it’s closer to $500 an hour. Most reliable airplane I’ve ever owned.
Most of the owners/operators I have talked to (20+) spend closer to the $1200 an hour, especially if you include engine reserve and training.
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