18 Apr 2024, 06:35 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 03 Nov 2019, 14:30 |
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Joined: 07/06/14 Posts: 3008 Post Likes: +1993 Location: MA
Aircraft: Cessna 340A
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Username Protected wrote: Yah, thanks, I guess I remembered wrong.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 03 Nov 2019, 16:54 |
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Joined: 05/23/08 Posts: 6059 Post Likes: +703 Location: CMB7, Ottawa, Canada
Aircraft: TBM - C185 - T206
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Do you really think an airplane company can survive on 50 sales? Thats all Tecnam will sell. Nobody besides Cape Air wants an avgas piston twin. Cessna or Piper are not that stupid. Username Protected wrote: Amazing how a company could literally have people throwing money at them and they refuse. Now they got neither 402 sales nor Caravan sales (probably could have sold a few dozen others) and have provided a foothold for a new competitor. Plus I’m sure Continental was like “Doood! We could have made some bank on 100 engines and spares!!”
Makes me wonder if someone went to B/C/P and offered to buy the defunct part of the piston IP if they’d even sell.
Best, Rich
_________________ Former Baron 58 owner. Pistons engines are for tractors.
Marc Bourdon
Last edited on 03 Nov 2019, 17:06, edited 1 time in total.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 03 Nov 2019, 19:10 |
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Joined: 11/30/18 Posts: 2230 Post Likes: +1720 Location: NH
Aircraft: F33A, A320
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They have 25 others sold to operators other than Cape Air. There are also a lot of Islanders in the world that are going to need replacing soon that the P2012 will be perfect for.
Turbines are good, but there are some missions that they just aren't suited for.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 04 Nov 2019, 22:00 |
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Joined: 07/04/11 Posts: 1712 Post Likes: +242 Company: W. John Gadd, Esq. Location: Florida
Aircraft: C55 Baron
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Username Protected wrote: They have 25 others sold to operators other than Cape Air. There are also a lot of Islanders in the world that are going to need replacing soon that the P2012 will be perfect for.
Turbines are good, but there are some missions that they just aren't suited for. Think there's a market. And the involved companies sure do as well.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 30 Nov 2019, 22:30 |
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Joined: 10/30/10 Posts: 1695 Post Likes: +826 Company: Ten Bits Ranch Location: Terlingua, TX
Aircraft: H35, F90, C205, C182
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Username Protected wrote: I bet we will see some of these in the tour biz in AZ for Grand Canyon tours. Lots of old 206 and 208's running around that need to be replaced.
Mike Agree. Scenic tours prefer high wing. 1-2 hour flights, low & slow. KJ
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 01 Dec 2019, 17:24 |
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Joined: 02/09/09 Posts: 5587 Post Likes: +2544 Location: Owosso, MI (KRNP)
Aircraft: 1969 Bonanza V35A
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Username Protected wrote: Amazing how a company could literally have people throwing money at them and they refuse. Now they got neither 402 sales nor Caravan sales (probably could have sold a few dozen others) and have provided a foothold for a new competitor. Plus I’m sure Continental was like “Doood! We could have made some bank on 100 engines and spares!!”
Makes me wonder if someone went to B/C/P and offered to buy the defunct part of the piston IP if they’d even sell.
Best, Rich I'd be willing to bet Textron, that owns Cessna and Lycoming made a bigger profit just selling Tecnam the engines than reproducing 402C's and converting them to a Lycoming... All with very little added liability, financial risk, work, or headaches.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 07 Dec 2019, 01:56 |
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Joined: 07/10/17 Posts: 79 Post Likes: +39
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Username Protected wrote: Do you really think an airplane company can survive on 50 sales? Thats all Tecnam will sell. Nobody besides Cape Air wants an avgas piston twin. Cessna or Piper are not that stupid.
I'm curious how the economics of the Tecnam will compare to the economics of operating a Caravan. Because there are four million caravans to replace.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 22 Jun 2020, 23:45 |
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Joined: 11/24/14 Posts: 371 Post Likes: +241 Location: Kirkland, WA
Aircraft: Casually browsing
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Today I left St. Louis on a commercial flight and caught a glimpse of the new Tecnam in the wild. Perhaps it’s old news, but I thought it was pretty cool seeing a new airplane design in service. It’s definitely got a modern style and look to it.
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Post subject: Re: Tecnam P2012 Traveller Posted: 23 Jun 2020, 16:25 |
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Joined: 05/30/17 Posts: 198 Post Likes: +159
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I think it’s a nice looking airplane that definitely has a potential niche in the market. Tecnam and Diamond are interesting in that they produce only piston aircraft, no turbines. Cirrus produced the most pistons in 2019 (384); followed by Piper (260), Diamond (233), Textron (218), then Tecnam (205). That’s both single and multi pistons. Those five companies produced 98% of all the certified piston aircraft made globally (at least among GAMA members) in 2019. Only 24 other pistons were produced by others, scattered among several manufacturers (including CubCrafters).
I think it’s great that we have two piston-only manufacturers, interestingly both of whom are located outside the US (Austria and Italy, respectively). And that despite the lower prices of pistons generally speaking (the 1.4 mm DA62 is something of an exception, but then Piper charges the same for a new M350 and Textron charges about that much for a new Baron), and hence lower margins, some of these companies are still coming up with new and improved designs.
The 2012 will likely succeed at modest production. Nothing like business jets either in volume (Cessna just produced the 250th M2) or margin (hard to beat selling planes at 5 mm plus per unit). But they are still plugging away.
The other nice thing about Tecnam is that it’s family-owned in Italy and still profitable. All the others except Textron are owned by foreign investors if memory serves. So I’m cheering for them to succeed, stay focused on the humble piston and stay independent!
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