BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Aug 2019, 02:29

Speaking of how you fly an airliner at an airshow...

This is a friend of mine showing his mastery of the 747. He's one of the finest pilots you will ever see fly an airplane. It's worth very bit of the 2.5 minutes to watch the video.

If you're really in a hurry, fast forward to the 1:40 point and watch his low pass down the runway.

I believe the 757 would excel in an airshow routine. I wish I could find a sponsor to let me do it. So... in that case, I'd gladly take the 757 over the 737. No doubt.

Of course, if I did... I'd have them install a cockpit intercom system for about what it costs to run the jet for 90 seconds of flight. So I could... you know... talk to the other pilot.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Aug 2019, 11:54

You youngsters obviously have never had the pleasure of trying to talk to the other pilot (or FE) in a 727. We were amazed at how much quieter the 75 and 76 were when they came along.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Aug 2019, 12:14

Username Protected wrote:

You youngsters obviously have never had the pleasure of trying to talk to the other pilot (or FE) in a 727. We were amazed at how much quieter the 75 and 76 were when they came along.

The B727 @ .85M was as loud as we could go and NO intercom. (We had long range fuel tanks for that fuel burn)

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Aug 2019, 12:28

Username Protected wrote:

A major problem for me is the lack of a decent intercom. As a result, the pilots have to talk cross-cockpit over the roar of the engine, vent, and wind noise. It's easier to talk to the other pilot in the 1940 J-3 that I fly using the portable battery-powered intercom system that we use. It's just amazing to me that in this day of focus on critical comm, CRM, safety and the like, that this hasn't been upgraded on the 757 fleet. I've been on flights with soft-spoken captains where I literally asked them 20+ times to "say again?" And frankly, it's just a lot less fatiguing to have good noise-cancelling headset on rather than lots of ambient noise for 6+ hours. A good intercom is what I miss the most about the 737.

Since 99.44% of the 757 pilots don't wear a full headset... and most takeoff the mandatory earpiece above FL180 and go to speaker... I'm guessing they will have significant hearing loss after 10 years flying it. Cockpit noise runs >80 db.

So the 757 doesn't have the "rubber band" option to do a hot mike intercom? Dang, I guess I won't ever bid the 757...

I gotta have my DC ANR headset as the 737 is just too stupid loud for trying to communicate. I'd guess that at my shop 90+% of 737 crews are using headsets and the rubber band hot mike... thankfully. But, I've heard that there are a few crusty captains that just refuse to get onboard with using the intercom... HUH? WHAT'D YOU SAY??

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Aug 2019, 19:01

Whoops. Here's the video link that didn't download of the 747 flyby.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08G4z63PShc

Username Protected wrote:

So the 757 doesn't have the "rubber band" option to do a hot mike intercom?

But, I've heard that there are a few crusty captains that just refuse to get onboard with using the intercom...

Correct... no rubber band option.

During my 30 months on the 737, things changed quite a bit. When I first started, there were quite a few that didn't use full headsets. Buy the time I left (this past January), it was really rare to come across a 737 Cappy that still used the earpiece. I could speculate why, but like most FO's I'm just glad it happened.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 20 Aug 2019, 22:20

Username Protected wrote:

I was a 727 FE for 18 months. Your recollection is probably better than mine, but I don't recall it being that much louder, given the same Mach number.

[/quote]

And just how many times have you seen a 737 turning in 727 mach numbers?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Aug 2019, 01:48

Username Protected wrote:

And just how many times have you seen a 737 turning in 727 mach numbers?

I'm referring to the 757, not the 737.
Everyone knows the 737 is loud.
However, the "word on the street" seems to be the 757 is not nearly as loud.

So, generally I see .81 on the 757.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Aug 2019, 09:40

It'll do .83 if you're trying to make a commute. :whistle:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 21 Aug 2019, 22:51

To use the intercom you have to wear a headset. That gets old after an hour or two. Most guys pull the headset off at 18k or so...at least where I work.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 24 Aug 2019, 15:12

Username Protected wrote:

To use the intercom you have to wear a headset. That gets old after an hour or two. Most guys pull the headset off at 18k or so...at least where I work.

Never needed the headset cept for TO/Ldg on the DC-10 or Airbus both extremely comfortable when compared to a Boeing. My ears are still ringing after flying the 3-Holer for 11 yrs.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 25 Aug 2019, 20:40

Username Protected wrote:

To use the intercom you have to wear a headset. That gets old after an hour or two.

The point made by many on another forum was that:

1. Headset comfort is a completely different ballgame than it was 10 years ago. Most of us on the 737 wore our headsets the entire time.

2. Headset sound quality is a completely different ballgame than it was 10 years ago. Better mics and ANR have created some great products.

3. The ones that refuse to wear a new, modern headsets might not realize what they are missing, since some have refused for well over a decade.

The Cherokee 140 vs Super Cub analogy is funny... but not applicable. If I'm spending 15 days a month (and 900 hours annually) in a loud jet... I'm going to consider the things that cause fatigue and hearing loss.

As it is configured, using an intercom on the 757 is currently impractical. And that's a shame. We should be at least given a choice.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 25 Aug 2019, 21:17

On the 75 and 76 that I flew about 18 years ago there were two positions on the mike switch. If you pushed (squeezed with your finger) the top half of the switch, you transmitted on the radio. If you pushed the bottom, it was the interphone. Therefore you could, if both pilots wore the right kind of headsets, communicate through the interphone although I don't ever remember anyone doing that. At that time I don't remember anyone wearing a headset that covered both ears and most people removed the headset completely above 10000 or so. As I said earlier, after enduring the 727, we thought these airplanes were pretty quiet.

Back in my C-141 days we wore the headsets all the time and communicated over the interphone but it was much louder and the crew stations were a good bit farther apart and that was really the only way to hear the other crewmembers.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 25 Aug 2019, 21:51

If I remember right, there are different intercoms that the airline can specify. I seem to remember a memo that some of our new airplanes have the switch for a hot intercom.

Enroute, I usually don't wear a headset unless I'm someplace with a strong language barrier such as Japanese women and italian controllers that are the two worse.

The 747-400 is the loudest jet inside that I've ever flown. It's an airplane that needs noise canceling headsets all the time. The MD-11 was the quietest by far that I've flown..

Compare a 737 and 757