28 Mar 2024, 06:42 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
|
Username Protected |
Message |
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 03:46 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: 08/21/16 Posts: 4
|
|
Also just FWIW, at my home field of KPAO with our 2400’ of runway, there is P180 that operates regularly from and is based here. It’s in the Rossi hangar, I’m sure they can provide some real world data on short runway performance.
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 04:19 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: 12/17/13 Posts: 6322 Post Likes: +5519 Location: Hollywood, Los Angeles, CA
Aircraft: Turbo Commander 680V
|
|
Username Protected wrote: I am still a skeptical on the price (1.1M with 8K hours and 2K left on the engines) - I just believe when something looks too good to be true, it probably is - I just haven't seen the smoking gun yet. I'll let you know. Alex - the P180 has a 10000hr airframe limit unless it has an SB that extends it to 15000hrs (they were working on a 20K hour limit before bust). Make sure they have this or can get this, or else it's a pumpkin at 10K hours. Penman, no way it's a $2K/hr plane. It's somewhere between $1-1.3K/hr. Anthony - I agree with most, if not all of your points. But with 420gal fuel, it's a little challenged when the power levers hit the wall. Fast as hell, but not great range. To get to good range, you kinda have to throttle back a little to around 350-360kts like you said. From memory, you can hit almost 1800nm in range if you're willing to give up some speed. If anyone's interested, I have the POH.
_________________ Problem is the intelligent people are full of doubt, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.
Last edited on 06 Aug 2019, 09:37, edited 1 time in total.
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 05:23 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: 03/09/13 Posts: 910 Post Likes: +449 Location: Byron Bay,NSW Australia
Aircraft: CE525,PA31
|
|
Username Protected wrote: If anyone's interested, I have the POH. Yes please, advann@mac.comSweet plane. Thanks Andrew
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 08:57 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: 02/07/16 Posts: 565 Post Likes: +159 Location: KPMP, WMSA (Kuala Lumpur) Paris (LFPB)
Aircraft: Work Falcon Fun Duke
|
|
I have always been P180 fan, I recall the purchase of SN#13 from Genoa. However $1300/H? That doesn't seem realistic, certified multi crew, provisions, Etc... Not sure how you get that low, though I wish it was.
_________________ JetSpeed Solutions, Falcon 8X/7X, Falcon 2000LXS, Falcon 2000 Classic and the Duke!
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 09:07 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: 07/11/11 Posts: 2252 Post Likes: +2213 Location: Queretaro / Woodlands
Aircraft: C525 BE40 D1K Waco
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Alex - the P180 has a 10000hr airframe limit unless it has an SB that extends it to 15000hrs (they were working on a 20K hour limit before bust). Make sure they have this or can get this, or else it's a pumping at 10K hours.
Adam - i cannot find any reference to the 10,000 hour airframe limit or anything regarding the SB you discuss. What is a good source for this?
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 09:55 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Penman, no way it's a $2K/hr plane. It's somewhere between $1-1.3K/hr.
Not a chance in hell is it lower than 2k. Fix ANYTHING on that airplane pushes that number past 4k. I've also found that with the success of the economy the costs of things lately has skyrocketed. Airplanes are no different. My PC12 is costing me more to operate when factoring in landing fees, overnights, etc. I still like em Alex my friend, we'll come and visit and swing by a break on the way down/up. I need some of your cooking.
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 09:55 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: 09/17/15 Posts: 153 Post Likes: +150 Location: LIMG / EDDK
Aircraft: PA-28 / C172
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Alex - the P180 has a 10000hr airframe limit unless it has an SB that extends it to 15000hrs (they were working on a 20K hour limit before bust). Make sure they have this or can get this, or else it's a pumping at 10K hours.
Adam - i cannot find any reference to the 10,000 hour airframe limit or anything regarding the SB you discuss. What is a good source for this?
If I remember well, in order to extend the service life to 15000 fh, airplanes from S/N 1003 to 1033 included requires early introduction of four structural SB's (SB's 80-0031 and others).
Early introduction means that SB installation shall be accomplished whitin a certain limit of FH (don't remember exactly, maybe before 3000 FH logbook).
Younger Avanti (S/N 1034 - 1104), Avanti II (S/N 1105+) and Evo (S/N 3001+) all have a structural limit of 15000 FH since factory delivery.
Hope this helps.
DS
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 10:27 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: 12/17/13 Posts: 6322 Post Likes: +5519 Location: Hollywood, Los Angeles, CA
Aircraft: Turbo Commander 680V
|
|
Username Protected wrote: Not a chance in hell is it lower than 2k. Fix ANYTHING on that airplane pushes that number past 4k. Depends of course on how you calculate; if you include your dental plan, chief pilots health care and hangar pets grooming, etc. But here are rough numbers for an owner operator: Engine reserve: $420/hr (I was quoted this as number on a lease I inquired about)L/G reserve (based on on 300hrs/year): $98/hr - and this is optional part 91.Fuel (80gal/hr average): $280/hr And including the BJT numbers in link above: Maintenance labor (at $90 per flight hour): $141.70/hrParts, airframe, engine, avionics: $126.63/hrInspections, component overhauls, life limited parts: $190.60/hrTotal: $ 1256/hrBut many of these numbers seem high to me. I don't think you need $210/hr/side engine reserve. That would suggest a -66 engine would cost $750K to overhaul. Maybe it does, but I think the number is closer to $500K.
_________________ Problem is the intelligent people are full of doubt, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.
Last edited on 06 Aug 2019, 11:05, edited 6 times in total.
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 10:50 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: 10/10/14 Posts: 1470 Post Likes: +1199 Location: St George UT
Aircraft: Mooney D 1964
|
|
The Type Certificate Data Sheet says this about life limited parts (might be a first start to find the 10,000 hr limit)
5. Continued Airworthiness Airworthiness Limitations and Service Life Limits of some equipment are contained in Chapter 4 (Airworthiness Limitations) and Chapter 5 (Maintenance Schedule and Time Limits) of the Piaggio Report n. 9066
|
|
Top |
|
Username Protected
|
Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread. Posted: 06 Aug 2019, 19:32 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: 07/11/11 Posts: 2252 Post Likes: +2213 Location: Queretaro / Woodlands
Aircraft: C525 BE40 D1K Waco
|
|
Username Protected wrote: If I remember well, in order to extend the service life to 15000 fh, airplanes from S/N 1003 to 1033 included requires early introduction of four structural SB's (SB's 80-0031 and others).
Early introduction means that SB installation shall be accomplished whitin a certain limit of FH (don't remember exactly, maybe before 3000 FH logbook).
Younger Avanti (S/N 1034 - 1104), Avanti II (S/N 1105+) and Evo (S/N 3001+) all have a structural limit of 15000 FH since factory delivery.
Hope this helps.
DS Thanks Daniele - this is very helpful.
|
|
Top |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum
|
Terms of Service | Forum FAQ | Contact Us
BeechTalk, LLC is the quintessential Beechcraft Owners & Pilots Group providing a
forum for the discussion of technical, practical, and entertaining issues relating to all Beech aircraft. These include
the Bonanza (both V-tail and straight-tail models), Baron, Debonair, Duke, Twin Bonanza, King Air, Sierra, Skipper, Sport, Sundowner,
Musketeer, Travel Air, Starship, Queen Air, BeechJet, and Premier lines of airplanes, turboprops, and turbojets.
BeechTalk, LLC is not affiliated or endorsed by the Beechcraft Corporation, its subsidiaries, or affiliates.
Beechcraft™, King Air™, and Travel Air™ are the registered trademarks of the Beechcraft Corporation.
Copyright© BeechTalk, LLC 2007-2024
|
|
|
|