John - if you need the range and don't by mind the 2 pilot thing, plus the expense that goes with it, you might want to consider the Citation III. Fast, good range, great cabin, good purchase price and excellent support network.

It also is a very predictable and good airplane with no bad habits.

Several parts have become difficult to source for the Citation 3, 6, and 7. Would not suggest buying a 650 series Citation.

I was about to say, the Westwind II has 3000nm range, same TFE engines and is a lot less to get into.

But obviously, I'm all for the P180 solution, John!

I was going to stay out of this thread and let it go. However, in the spirit of getting accurate information out there, the Westwind does not have 3,000 nm of range. Neither does the Astra. The Astra SPX almost does, about 2900 nm as I recall. The Astra and Astra SP have about 2500 nm of range. And the Westwind model with the most range is about 2350 nm.

I was going to stay out of this thread and let it go. However, in the spirit of getting accurate information out there, the Westwind does not have 3,000 nm of range. Neither does the Astra. The Astra SPX almost does, about 2900 nm as I recall. The Astra and Astra SP have about 2500 nm of range. And the Westwind model with the most range is about 2350 nm.

Several parts have become difficult to source for the Citation 3, 6, and 7. Would not suggest buying a 650 series Citation.

I'm not saying the support is any worse or better than Piaggio, Westwind, etc. I am saying parts availability is becoming an issue for the 650 series. I got this info from the Mesa, AZ and Wichita, KS service centers. But please, dont take my word for it, ask Cessna! I'm heavily involved with Citations, but less so on the 650 series.

Good to know Mitch. You learn something new every day. Thanks

John knows my opinion on the topic of two pilots. For the record: This is a bit of a holy war from what I can tell. Strong camps on both sides. Lots of emotion. Two pilot advocates stress the safety angle but frankly if they were logically consistent they would not fly any plane single pilot. Not very practical. I would think the risk flying a SP jet cross country is less than flying my 310. Not really comparable IMO.

I would only do a two pilot crew if the second pilot was my employee (vs contractor) and I flew a plane and lived in an area where I had lots of supply. Where John lives the risk is having an aircraft that requires two pilots and not being able to find a second pilot. You decide the one you have is intolerable what options do you have? That puts you at the mercy of someone else. F that! You finally have a jet and you are dependent on someone else who, because of supply issues, has leverage? How many Astra pilots in Montrose?

Frankly, at this stage in my life...it's my way or the highway. Ha!
Just say no!

Its all about the other guy. I love flying with 2 pilots, but once in a while you get a odd ball and it makes for a long trip.

Same can be said flying SP when you get the guy with 10 hrs sitting right seat asking dumbass questions for the whole trip.

2 pilots is generally more fun and safer, BUT you have to get the right guy.

You can alway$ find a $econd pilot.

You can alway$ find a $econd pilot.

I couldn't agree more. I am single pilot to the bone. If I paid a couple MM for something, and needed the consensus of even one more living breathing soul to operate it at my whim, I'd have a stroke on the spot, lose my medical, and have to hire a pilot. No Bueno!

That's my motto!

Look, I have a few thousand hours flying jets SP and I always said I would never own a two pilot aircraft. The truth is, now that I own a two pilot jet, absolutely nothing has changed for me. You guys who think you have to manage someone, will have to cancel trips, not be able to change plans last minute, will be annoyed by having to spend time with someone else, whatever other reason you come up with, just don't know what you are talking about. It's the same mentality people have saying they will only own a turboprop and never a jet because they don't want to have to do a type rating and a 61.58 every year, such a headache, blah blah blah. Jet owners know that it's not a big deal. Just like owners of jets requiring a SIC know that having a copilot is not a big deal.

Yeah. It helps when you have your GF as SIC.