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 Post subject: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 13:46 
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Continental Motors Completes First Flight on Unleaded AvGas

Flight marks a major milestone in TCM’s alternative fuels strategic program

March 31, 2009 – (Mobile, AL) – Teledyne Continental Motors, Inc. (TCM), in collaboration with Hawker Beechcraft Corporation, announces the first test flight of a certificated aircraft using Unleaded Aviation Fuel. “This is an accomplishment that adds to TCM’s catalog of aviation firsts, such as the introduction of a horizontally opposed cylinder configuration, fuel injection, turbo charging, and electronic engine controls (FADEC),” stated Rhett Ross, president of Teledyne Continental Motors. “TCM is committed to leading the industry towards a common 100LL alternative fuel that minimizes cost to aircraft owners,” Ross added.

ABS spoke with TCM's Mac Little, who confirmed the engine was a "stock" IO-550BB, and not reliant on FADEC or other add-on technology. "We want to preserve the fleet...with the least possible cost impact to customers," Little told ABS' Tom Turner. Upcoming tests with other types of fuels are pending, said Little, who quipped he would let us "read what [we] want" into the types of fuels to be investigated.

TCM's press release continues:

“This is another big step in our sustainability initiative at Hawker Beechcraft and something that will delight general aviation pilots,” said Ed Petkus, Hawker Beechcraft Vice President, Product Development and Engineering. “This partnership with TCM exemplifies the leadership of our companies and our commitment to supporting the technologies necessary to find an alternative to 100LL. I am confident our customers and the entire aviation industry will benefit from our joint efforts.”

TCM began investigating unleaded fuel alternatives to 100LL aviation gas in early 2007. Efforts included participation in the Coordinated Research Council (CRC), analysis of various commercial fuel options and extensive fuel tests on engines in the company’s dynamometer test cells. Prior to conducting its first flight, the company down-selected its flight test fuels to the unleaded fuel most likely to be submitted for certification and standardization as a piston aviation fuel.

The demonstration flight, performed by TCM pilot and engineer Keith Chatten and engine performance analyst Tim Kenney, occurred in a production G1000 equipped Model 36 Bonanza. The flight profile tested all aspects of flight including takeoff, climb, maximum power cruise, low power cruise, descent and landing. The airplane was equipped with data recording devices to provide data for post flight analysis. With the first flights complete, TCM will begin the certification process of several engine models to meet the needs for existing and future aircraft.

To learn more about the Continental Motors Alternative Fuels Strategy or to view a video of this groundbreaking flight, visit the Continental Motors website at www.tcmlink.com.


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 14:02 
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"TCM began investigating unleaded fuel alternatives to 100LL aviation gas in early 2007"

Wow, they are really ahead of the game, aren't they?

Anybody know what they actually tested? 95UL?


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 14:04 
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What's "unleaded aviation fuel"?

Is that easier to get than 100LL?


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 14:21 
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Username Protected wrote:
What's "unleaded aviation fuel"?

Is that easier to get than 100LL?


Not now... but you can bet we're headed that way!

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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 14:22 
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I can't seem to find any confirming data on the TCM website


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 14:59 
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Username Protected wrote:
I can't seem to find any confirming data on the TCM website


It's the lead story on aero-news.net. If the motor holds together thru testing, this is a big deal.


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 15:03 
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I wonder how TCM knows whether this is safe or not... I don't think they have anywhere near the testing capability that George Braly has.

I'd feel a lot better if George were running these tests (maybe already has?)


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 15:03 
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Username Protected wrote:
It's the lead story on aero-news.net. If the motor holds together thru testing, this is a big deal.


I see it on AVweb.com now too...reporting that it is 94UL.

http://www.youtube.com/user/gmerchant


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 15:43 
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Would this be different than mogas and why would it matter if not? Call me stupid but, if I can get a Cherokee 235 with mogas STC, admittedly a de-tuned Lycoming but still, what is the big deal here? If they just reduce the octane rating of Avgas but still blend it as such, hell will freeze over before the refiners pass any cost savings on to a small consumer market like GA.

Just my cynical $0.02

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 16:38 
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Username Protected wrote:
Would this be different than mogas and why would it matter if not? Call me stupid but, if I can get a Cherokee 235 with mogas STC, admittedly a de-tuned Lycoming but still, what is the big deal here? If they just reduce the octane rating of Avgas but still blend it as such, hell will freeze over before the refiners pass any cost savings on to a small consumer market like GA.

Just my cynical $0.02

Steve



My understanding is that the autogas STC requires unoxygenated auto fuel - which is rare. The autogas STC therefore has little to no practical application for a pilot that flies 100% within the law.

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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 16:57 
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Username Protected wrote:
So they are gonna replace 100LL with some aviation grade fuel that will cost the same right ?


:shrug:

I don't know how expensive the chemistry is. It would seem to me that UL avgas and mogas would cost about the same, and that LL would cost more than UL simply because of the limited marketability of lead and its supposed environmental risks.

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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 17:15 
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Username Protected wrote:
Continental Motors Completes First Flight on Unleaded AvGas

(etc etc)

To learn more about the Continental Motors Alternative Fuels Strategy or to view a video of this groundbreaking flight, visit the Continental Motors website at http://www.tcmlink.com.


OK what did they do for this groundbreaking flight... pull the throttle back? A Bonanza will (eventually) take off with 20" or so MP, which might be OK for mogas... is that what they did?

No details here on what they did. Highly unlikely they produced the rated 300hp.

They need to say what they did before someone actually believes they can run an IO550 on mogas. I go to their site but somehow I'm not seeing a link to any actual information on this. Somebody have a better link?

Dan


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 17:16 
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Aircraft: 1972 Bonanza V35B
Username Protected wrote:
Would this be different than mogas and why would it matter if not? Call me stupid but, if I can get a Cherokee 235 with mogas STC, admittedly a de-tuned Lycoming but still, what is the big deal here? If they just reduce the octane rating of Avgas but still blend it as such, hell will freeze over before the refiners pass any cost savings on to a small consumer market like GA.

Just my cynical $0.02

Steve


This will be an interesting test. I wonder if the "test" engine is "tuned" differently than factory spec. on the IO-550's intended to be used with 100LL as fuel. ??????? Timing???

For many years I was a distributor of Amoco fuels. We had the only 93 octane on the market. It was an unleaded fuel (Unfortunately BP chose to discontinue the production of this fuel after it acquired Amoco.). Setting the proper timing on the big carbureted V8's in trucks and cars made a big difference in performance and mileage with that fuel. That was in an era when 89 octane leaded fuel was 80~90 per cent of the market.

The compression of the engine is the main factor in the octane requirement. The Bonanzas with the 165/185/205/225 hp engines easily run, and run well, on 87 octane mogas (without methanol). These engines actually run better on mogas than 100LL. These engines have 7.0 compression ratios.

As the compression ratio gets higher (up to the 8.5:1 of the IO-550) the possibility of detonation/"pinging" increases dramatically with lower octane fuels. The light cases of these engines and other engine components made lighter for aviation service can't take much of this and the possibility of engine destruction is a real possibility. Getting full power at low altitudes with lower mogas octane is impossible with the higher ratio engines.

I have a friend who has two fuel tanks at his home airport. His plane has an IO-520 engine. From one tank he pumps 100LL into the left wing tank and from the other he pumps 87 octane auto fuel (mogas) into the right wing tank. The mogas is for cruise only. He only uses from the right tank at density altitudes of 6,000'+. He saves at least 15 gallons in the left tank for lower altitude maneuvering/landing. He has done this for over twenty years. He has run three engines past 2500 hours before overhaul over that time.

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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 18:09 
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Amoco.

"White gas."


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 Post subject: Re: TCM flies Bonanza on unleaded av fuel
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2009, 18:36 
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Username Protected wrote:
Amoco.

"White gas."

YES! YES!

Dammit Tom, I miss that stuff. I used it in lawnmowers, boat motors, weedeaters, motorcycles, leaf blowers, chain saws and everything that had a motor. I NEVER had a problem with a start even after a long period of non-use. I recently had to have a 26 year-old blower rebuilt because the fuel system was "gummed up/fuel line disintegrated". (For those who might think I'm "cheap": I own another half dozen blowers, used for business. This one has sentimental value and is far better than anything currently built.) It had its original spark plug and had never failed to start on the first pull...until...I put the only available gummy alcohol F...ed up crap in it.

A list of testimonials on that gas would occupy many thousands of pages. There was no color added. There were no impurities or additives to clog things up, etc., etc.

I MISS IT. I MISS IT. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

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