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17 Dec 2017, 03:57 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


Greenwich AeroGroup



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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 24 Aug 2017, 19:51 
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Joined: 12/10/07
Posts: 12530
Post Likes: +1853
Location: St. Pete, FL
Aircraft: BE 58
Username Protected wrote:
One son is 28 and a Captain on a Falcon 50, got all his ratings at our home airport and making 6 figures.

The other son is 21, leaving next week to Tenn to get his A and P, then off to Dallas and American Flyers for CFI.

He will most likely come back and instruct at our local flight school.

It's a race for 21 year old to get 1500 hours, then lots of really decent jobs, maybe even getting hired at his bother's operation.

The 28 was hired and PIC typed in the 50 with NO training contract, go figure.
And he had NO turbine experience, but he did have 1200 hours instructing and 300 in our Baron.


RIck,

Good point. If you want it, it's out there, and overall not a bad job. Heck, you're kids could be doing something like you do <g>....

Sorry I missed you at OSH. Keep in touch.

_________________
Larry


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 24 Aug 2017, 20:46 
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Joined: 10/29/11
Posts: 102
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Location: Granbury, Texas
Aircraft: Looking
Hey Larry, I painted that statement I made with way to wide a brush. It was 2 extremes I saw during my career. I guess maybe my point was the training the 660 hr pilot got was pretty good and the 11K pilot was one of the weakest I saw. I agree 100 percent the best overall pilots flew commuters with no auto pilot in all kinds of weather. Then there were the ones that would take off and put their feet on the floor :pullhair:

Somehow we both seemed to have survived. The 1500 hr rule is ridiculous and we may live to see it go away as they run out of pilots.

Grant


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 10 Sep 2017, 14:19 
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Joined: 09/09/14
Posts: 107
Post Likes: +154
Location: KSMO
Aircraft: J-3C-65
Username Protected wrote:
The Asian markets are offering 10, 15, 20k per month starting salary + benefits depending on which aircraft and seat position. The US will not be able to compete with them (Asian airlines being government subsidies) and Asia will create a giant sucking sound for aviators.

I see a wave of pilot movement possible. Pilots start out in Asia. Then once they have time and experience and the airlines here are hurting enough, they start getting offers back in the states.

We'll see. But for now...there still isn't a full time job being offered even close to what I would consider taking.

-E


It's actually quite the opposite. The salaries you mention are the exception, not the rule. And even if you're able to earn 20K a month as an expat, you still have to put up with:

    Rostering shenanigans
    Host country politics
    Seat warming FO's you'll be afraid to leave alone to use the LAV.
    Horrendous schedules
    No job protection or representation

And let's not forget, you have to live in China, with all that clean air.

My observations is that people hardly ever leave the legacy positions over here. The sucking sound you mention is pilots employed overseas, leaving for much greener pastures.

You can live in Dubai, making 250K a year as a very hard-working widebody Captain. Or you can live here at home, surf, go shoot your guns, whatever floats your boat. And you can earn that 250 a year as an FO who has 22 days off a month, and an employer B-fund retirement.

No contest.


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 14 Nov 2017, 16:10 
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Joined: 05/04/11
Posts: 975
Post Likes: +250
Location: Morristown, NJ (MMU)
Aircraft: 1997 Baron 58
Username Protected wrote:

It's actually quite the opposite. The salaries you mention are the exception, not the rule. And even if you're able to earn 20K a month as an expat, you still have to put up with:

    Rostering shenanigans
    Host country politics
    Seat warming FO's you'll be afraid to leave alone to use the LAV.
    Horrendous schedules
    No job protection or representation

And let's not forget, you have to live in China, with all that clean air.

My observations is that people hardly ever leave the legacy positions over here. The sucking sound you mention is pilots employed overseas, leaving for much greener pastures.

You can live in Dubai, making 250K a year as a very hard-working widebody Captain. Or you can live here at home, surf, go shoot your guns, whatever floats your boat. And you can earn that 250 a year as an FO who has 22 days off a month, and an employer B-fund retirement.

No contest.
I'm an immigrant, and I can strongly affirm this sentiment. If you've never suffered life in a country with no individual rights and liberties, and scant rule of law, you have no idea how good we have it here. I dont think anyone is offering enough money to make me want to leave the good ol' US of A.

I got my guns, I got my planes, I got my pickup truck, and I get to use them all whenever I want. :woot:


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 14 Nov 2017, 20:01 
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Joined: 12/10/07
Posts: 4644
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Location: New York, NY
Aircraft: Debonair C33A
Username Protected wrote:
Or you can live here at home, surf, go shoot your guns, whatever floats your boat. And you can earn that 250 a year as an FO who has 22 days off a month, and an employer B-fund retirement.


You can? As a FO? At which airline? :popcorn:


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 14 Nov 2017, 22:29 
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Joined: 06/25/08
Posts: 4195
Post Likes: +249
Company: Latitude Aviation
Location: New York, NY (KHPN)
Aircraft: 2007 Bonanza G36
Username Protected wrote:
Or you can live here at home, surf, go shoot your guns, whatever floats your boat. And you can earn that 250 a year as an FO who has 22 days off a month, and an employer B-fund retirement.


You can? As a FO? At which airline? :popcorn:


United, Delta, FedEx, etc. For example, the 12th year United 777/787 FO rate is $224.35/hour (and goes to $231.09/hour in January). Long haul widebody FO's at United can easily credit more than 1114 hours per year (the equivalent of $250k/year) due to trip/duty rigs, vacation, voluntary overtime, 150% and 200% overrides (due to being late or being cancelled, reassigned, etc). It isn't just about the hourly rate...the work rules and other pay credits really factor in as well.

-Neal
_________________
Latitude Aviation
Specializing in sales/acquisitions services for Bonanzas, Barons, and TBM's


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 15 Nov 2017, 14:51 
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Joined: 01/31/10
Posts: 513
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Location: Gainesville, FL
Aircraft: 1974 A36 Bonanza
Glad to see pay rates finally back up to what they were before all the bankruptcy’s.
Been a long climb back up for the senior guys. New guys must think this is normal.

Craig


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 Post subject: Re: 65yo mandatory retirement age
PostPosted: 15 Nov 2017, 19:29 
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Joined: 06/02/10
Posts: 3759
Post Likes: +736
Company: Inscrutable Fasteners, LLC
Location: Fort Lauderdale
Aircraft: TN IO550 V35B
Username Protected wrote:
Glad to see pay rates finally back up to what they were before all the bankruptcy’s.
Been a long climb back up for the senior guys. New guys must think this is normal.

Craig


Hi Craig,

True, but as you know, inflation takes a toll....we're taking almost 14 years now, so rates would need to be commensuratly higher to be equivalent....

Plus no DB plan....

Best,
Rich


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