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17 Dec 2017, 04:04 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


Greenwich AeroGroup



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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 23 Jun 2017, 18:15 
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Thanks Glenn, and sorry for the abbreviations.
FLC: Final Line Check
LHS: Left Hand Seat
CRM/MCC: Crew Resource Management/Multi-Crew Cooperation
LVO: Low Vis Ops (CAT II ILS+ 150m Take-Off)
t/r: type rating
PF/PM: pilot flying/pilot monitoring
P/A: passenger announcement
TLS/BRS: Toulouse/Bristol
CDFA: Constant Descent Final Approach, mandatory in Europe now

Speak 'Murican dammit. We're gonna ban all of you all dang furners if you keep this up :D


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 23 Jun 2017, 18:48 
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Company: NetJets
Location: Columbus, OH (KOSU)
Aircraft: 1961 Debonair A33
Don't forget about NetJets - I went there at age 57 - almost 12 years ago. Better pay AND a schedule that is to die for!

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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 23 Jun 2017, 19:11 
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Username Protected wrote:

Speak 'Murican dammit. We're gonna ban all of you all dang furners if you keep this up :D


I read and post over at airlinepilotforums.com (I'm not an airline pilot but you've inspired me and I'm trying to head that way :thumbup: ) and sometimes it's like reading a foreign language with all those acronyms and whatever. There's some posts I can't even understand. lol


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 27 Jun 2017, 17:20 
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Username Protected wrote:
And I am FINALLY heading off to ground school. After being indoctrinated into the airline on March 6, I have sat home of full pay for 3.5 months. In all fairness, I should have been called a month ago, but asked to be delayed to attend my 2 kids' graduations, yesterday and today.

WIll report back from systems and procedures training.



How's it going so far?

:popcorn:


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 14 Jul 2017, 16:55 
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Location: Ocala, Fl
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So my 3 month old journey to get into flying professionally is culminating today as I start my job as an FO for Piedmont Airlines.

For any with 1500 hours TT, 1st class medical and AMEL - this is a great time to go to the airlines. In a year or two, starting pay will approach $100K

I know some people deny the pilot shortage exists. I am quite certain it does. I have just two points to make in support:

1- I'm in my 50s, and I had offers from my top 2 regional airline options. I am not even the oldest in my cohort! 5 years ago - no one was hiring 50 yr olds with 0 turbine experience. Now, they are begging you to come in.

2- 18 months ago, $20K was the starting annual income. Today multiple regionals are offering bonuses to get annual pay over $60K. I expect to make well over $60K easily. Its still not enough pay for what experience and skill they are getting, but prices don't triple without a supply/demand imbalance.

Yes, if you have a family, you can't survive on the pay, but after 30 yrs on wall street, I have some money saved up. This job will actually pay enough to live on in about 3-4 years...


After you get some part 121 experience take a look at UPS, we are hiring 300+ this year and probably next year also. Great retirement and medical benefits pay is not bad either..


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 16 Jul 2017, 13:21 
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Location: Morristown, NJ (MMU)
Aircraft: 1997 Baron 58
Just back from systems and procedures ground school. It was a breeze - none of that drinking from a firehose stuff. I went in well prepared, knowing the systems, memory items, flows and profiles, and found myself not needing to cram. I learned a lot, by understanding it, as opposed to memorizing it.
Now I wait to be called back for Simulator training events.
So far, so good!


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 16 Jul 2017, 13:33 
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Username Protected wrote:
Just back from systems and procedures ground school. It was a breeze - none of that drinking from a firehose stuff. I went in well prepared, knowing the systems, memory items, flows and profiles, and found myself not needing to cram. I learned a lot, by understanding it, as opposed to memorizing it.
Now I wait to be called back for Simulator training events.
So far, so good!


So before you went to class they sent you all the systems, etc, so you could be studying before you went? Hook you up with an iPad with all the info? Speaking of that, are they paperless?

I can't remember, is this the CRJ or ERJ?


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 16 Jul 2017, 13:34 
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Aircraft: 1997 Baron 58
yes, many home study materials made available.
Not paperless yet - maybe September. iPads are distributed for all pilots and contain all the necessary manuals, but need to carry current manuals (fills the flight case) to be legal - including in the Simulator.
ERJ-145s only... Some DHC8-100,300 remain, but are getting phased out..


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 22 Jul 2017, 17:52 
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Any word on airline degree requirements? I'm guessing 2 two-year degrees, though both aviation related, probably don't cut it.


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 22 Jul 2017, 18:53 
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The regional doesn't really require one. I've also read that if you're hired by the regional without one and you're flowing to their main major carrier that they don't really require it either.


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 22 Jul 2017, 18:57 
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Location: Central Florida
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Username Protected wrote:
So my 3 month old journey to get into flying professionally is culminating today as I start my job as an FO for Piedmont Airlines.

For any with 1500 hours TT, 1st class medical and AMEL - this is a great time to go to the airlines. In a year or two, starting pay will approach $100K

I know some people deny the pilot shortage exists. I am quite certain it does. I have just two points to make in support:

1- I'm in my 50s, and I had offers from my top 2 regional airline options. I am not even the oldest in my cohort! 5 years ago - no one was hiring 50 yr olds with 0 turbine experience. Now, they are begging you to come in.

2- 18 months ago, $20K was the starting annual income. Today multiple regionals are offering bonuses to get annual pay over $60K. I expect to make well over $60K easily. Its still not enough pay for what experience and skill they are getting, but prices don't triple without a supply/demand imbalance.

Yes, if you have a family, you can't survive on the pay, but after 30 yrs on wall street, I have some money saved up. This job will actually pay enough to live on in about 3-4 years...


After you get some part 121 experience take a look at UPS, we are hiring 300+ this year and probably next year also. Great retirement and medical benefits pay is not bad either..


What's the mandatory retirement age for freight operations?

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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 22 Jul 2017, 19:59 
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All P121 carriers have the age 65 rule.


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 12:20 
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Raj - any updates? I'm living vicariously...

During my summer MBA internship at one of the major airline's corporate finance / strategy departments, I put together a project describing the pilot shortage, causes, likely impacts, and ideas for mitigating it. This was about 5 years ago. I had about 1500hrs and briefly thought about throwing some applications to a couple of regionals (I'm good at desk jobs, but would prefer to fly) but the starting pay was near $20k and the wife said no way. The history that built to this is interesting. I'm curious to see how long it lasts, there are a lot of independent factors, some of which are cyclical and some of which are longer-term trends. I'm hoping by the time I'm comfortable enough to consider starting over a new career there will be opportunities like this still, whether it's 121, 135, or 91.

The airlines didn't see this coming early on. The regionals were seeing it around 2013/14 and had difficulty convincing the majors it was real.


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 29 Aug 2017, 21:20 
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Company: Latitude Aviation
Location: New York, NY (KHPN)
Aircraft: 2007 Bonanza G36
Username Protected wrote:
Raj - any updates? I'm living vicariously...

During my summer MBA internship at one of the major airline's corporate finance / strategy departments, I put together a project describing the pilot shortage, causes, likely impacts, and ideas for mitigating it. This was about 5 years ago. I had about 1500hrs and briefly thought about throwing some applications to a couple of regionals (I'm good at desk jobs, but would prefer to fly) but the starting pay was near $20k and the wife said no way. The history that built to this is interesting. I'm curious to see how long it lasts, there are a lot of independent factors, some of which are cyclical and some of which are longer-term trends. I'm hoping by the time I'm comfortable enough to consider starting over a new career there will be opportunities like this still, whether it's 121, 135, or 91.

The airlines didn't see this coming early on. The regionals were seeing it around 2013/14 and had difficulty convincing the majors it was real.


Graham,

I agree that the history that built to this is certainly interesting but the current situation hasn't come as a surprise to most people I know in the 121 world (myself included). It is just basic economics and math. In my view there isn't a pilot shortage at the majors/legacies yet (and won't be for a long time if ever). There is certainly a shortage of people, however, willing to go to the regionals for the current pay rates (even the recently improved rates/bonuses, etc). I'm sure that this situation will continue for a while so if you get the hankering to leave the MS Excel/Powerpoint world for the FMS/ACARS world come on in...the water is warm!

My airline (a legacy based in Chicago) just cancelled all new hire classes through February and we're only hiring 400 in 2018 (as of now...that plan probably changes a few more times of course). We have north of 10,000 applications on file for those 400 spots. I know it is the same situation at the other majors and legacies (tons of applications from qualified candidates for far fewer spots available).

-Neal

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Specializing in sales/acquisitions services for Bonanzas, Barons, and TBM's


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 Post subject: Re: Im going to be an airline pilot - yes, pilot shortage ex
PostPosted: 02 Sep 2017, 17:36 
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Username Protected wrote:
In my view there isn't a pilot shortage at the majors/legacies yet (and won't be for a long time if ever). There is certainly a shortage of people, however, willing to go to the regionals for the current pay rates (even the recently improved rates/bonuses, etc).


Here is the thing: the theory that regionals only have a shortage due to current pay rates implies that there are qualified pilots out there who could fill the regional's seats but won't because the pay is not enough. The question then is, what are those pilots are doing instead? I doubt there are many pilots who invested enough into their training to be qualified for ATP and then just walked away and changed the profession.

So if regionals desperately needed pilots and were willing to up the starting pay to, say, $100k, would that help? Sure, that change would cause more folks to look favorably at flying profession again and go into flight training. That will increase the supply of pilots 3-5 years down the road. But where do they get the pilots if they need them now?


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