http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/Pi ... 629-1.html

Now, I wonder if they have the brains to restart the Cheyenne line. Can't tell me they wouldn't sell, especially since HBC is still quite delusional with King Air pricing. We need competition in this market!

Don't you mean.....

I am shocked

This is sad. This was a beautiful prototype. I was looking forward to seeing one on my ramp.

In other small jet news - 2 of my clients ordered Citation M2s at NBAA. Some American manufacturers are doing OK.

When they too Randy out and put Simon in it was quite clear.

They need to bring back the 400LS.

Piper's been aggressively recruiting engineering and manufacturing talent for the jet here in Wichita for about a year. Job fairs, billboards, the works. I know several people who went to Vero Beach, including engineers in the HBC piston and turboprop arena. I understand the company is starting a "Design by Piper" third-party engineering division (contract talent for STCs, OEM design, etc.) and a "Manufactured by Piper" contract production capability, but I bet a lot of people have made the move only to find themselves without a job.

The market seems to be showing there is limited demand for anyone's single-engine jet in the current economic reality. Piper's announcement says it was meeting all design and budget goals, it just didn't see enough potential sales right now to make it profitable.

I wonder what they base that decision on? Overall jet sales? Jet sales are down because they drink too much gas. SE jet would answer that. Since there isn't a SE jet on the market at all how can they think it wouldn't sell? My PC12 dealer can't keep them on the shelf.

Are the people who run these aviation companies all idiots? Or is this like Solyndra where you know it will fail, but you build it anyway? And stuff your pockets on the way I'm sure

Pretty simple analysis to me as I work in the upper end race horse business. There is no significant bottom or middle market in this economy, only an upper and they have no need for a puny little jet that might make 300 kts and 1000 miles. The PC12 is an economical exception and not in need of certification.

Here is how the rice munchers do it. 4.5 million gets you a new dynamic performer, duel jet, hauling 2 crew 6 passengers at 425 knots. GE Honda turbo fans, range up to 1400 NM. They have a 260,000 sq ft facility in greensboro north carolina, supposed to be ready to go third quarter 2012. They claim to have 100 orders taken? Requires 4000 ft runway, lands in 3K. It doesnt say fuel capacity or fuel burn rate, but it is supposed to be very fuel efficient. www.hondajet.com

I did my homework on this plane and my math used to say full fuel payload is a 60lb pilot. It's not going close to 1400NM without full fuel and 41k'. Also, 1100fpm climb.. wat?

Order deposits are 100% refundable.

I hope it does well and I hope I'm wrong but it just seems all these little jets need too much gas to fly and it screws up everything else.

What piper should do is keep the Altaire, mount a giant turbo prop up front and compete with the TBM/Pilatus crowd. Can you imagine TBM performance with potty in the same price range.

"Pretty simple analysis to me as I work in the upper end race horse business. There is no significant bottom or middle market in this economy, only an upper and they have no need for a puny little jet that might make 300 kts and 1000 miles. The PC12 is an economical exception and not in need of certification."

Yup. That's it exactly. It's a great time to work at Gulfstream or Van's Aircraft, and just about nowhere in between.
Robin White

Gentlemen,

I think that oversimplifies things by a fair amount.

There is a tremendous "middle" market in many areas of the economy.

Aviation is unique in that we can save a lot of money by buying used and in many cases the performance of the used aircraft equals or exceeds the capabilities of new. The biggest advantage the new aircraft have is in avionics and interior finishes, and now there are many fine options available in the retrofit market that give on much of the look and feel of new at a much lower price point.

Regards, Jim