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28 Mar 2024, 12:49 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 21:15 
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Joined: 11/23/15
Posts: 186
Post Likes: +58
Location: Greensboro, NC
Aircraft: Twin Bonanza, MU2
Been flying the HondaJet for 3 years.
Great plane, easy to fly, easy to land and the one that I fly has been super reliable.
The G3000 is so intuitive and makes you look good.

However, for the untrained/ inexperienced pilot it can be an handful on a wet runway. Not having TRs or a speed brake that kills lift, landing on non grooved we runway requires a little more pavement. When I started flying it, the AFM did not include wet runway data, but the G3000 did but even the FlightSafety instructors were not sure. I finally determined that if you applied the corrections required by 135.385 for wet runways, at typical weight you legally required 5800 feet of runway prior to takeoff. Again this was on a wet runway. I never had any issues getting it stopped as long as you are on speed and touched down in the touchdown zone. The wheels are small, and the anti skid does work hard, what is does not always feels good. The newer aircraft have a lift dump system what will address operations on wet runways allowing the use of less than 6000 feet.

People have complained about the hard 20 Knot crosswind limitation. Owners can upgrade to the Elite S, and thru a software upgrade, nose wheel steering has been improved resulting at a 25 knot demonstrated cross wind limitation.

Earlier this year, HondaJet introduced a phased maintenance program, replacing the 600/ 1200 hours inspections with four (4) 150 hour inspections. This inspections suppose to reduce maintenance downtime.

My only gripe with HondaJet is their P3 program. The aircraft that I fly is based on Greensboro, next to the factory and until recently, every time/cycle/ hour limit component or inspection was not scheduled until it’s due date, resulting in downtime that could been avoided. Secondly, a 5 day tire change is totally unacceptable.

The demise of JetIt was predictable. Charging an owner 1600 for live hours only, only covers your maintenance reserves and fuel. You have not paid for ferries, pilots and administrative cost. They, like so many before were a transactional company and you rely of explosive growth; you raise capital thru aircraft sales to fund your operation. That is a “challenging” way of running a business, as many before, and many after are finding out.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 27 May 2023, 21:21 
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Joined: 03/04/13
Posts: 4281
Post Likes: +3082
Location: Hampton, VA
Username Protected wrote:
Been flying the HondaJet for 3 years.
Great plane, easy to fly, easy to land and the one that I fly has been super reliable.
The G3000 is so intuitive and makes you look good.

However, for the untrained/ inexperienced pilot it can be an handful on a wet runway. Not having TRs or a speed brake that kills lift, landing on non grooved we runway requires a little more pavement. When I started flying it, the AFM did not include wet runway data, but the G3000 did but even the FlightSafety instructors were not sure. I finally determined that if you applied the corrections required by 135.385 for wet runways, at typical weight you legally required 5800 feet of runway prior to takeoff. Again this was on a wet runway. I never had any issues getting it stopped as long as you are on speed and touched down in the touchdown zone. The wheels are small, and the anti skid does work hard, what is does not always feels good. The newer aircraft have a lift dump system what will address operations on wet runways allowing the use of less than 6000 feet.

People have complained about the hard 20 Knot crosswind limitation. Owners can upgrade to the Elite S, and thru a software upgrade, nose wheel steering has been improved resulting at a 25 knot demonstrated cross wind limitation.

Earlier this year, HondaJet introduced a phased maintenance program, replacing the 600/ 1200 hours inspections with four (4) 150 hour inspections. This inspections suppose to reduce maintenance downtime.

My only gripe with HondaJet is their P3 program. The aircraft that I fly is based on Greensboro, next to the factory and until recently, every time/cycle/ hour limit component or inspection was not scheduled until it’s due date, resulting in downtime that could been avoided. Secondly, a 5 day tire change is totally unacceptable.

The demise of JetIt was predictable. Charging an owner 1600 for live hours only, only covers your maintenance reserves and fuel. You have not paid for ferries, pilots and administrative cost. They, like so many before were a transactional company and you rely of explosive growth; you raise capital thru aircraft sales to fund your operation. That is a “challenging” way of running a business, as many before, and many after are finding out.



No speed brakes seems odd for a modern aircraft, same with the small wheels, especially if you don’t want to rock TRs, which I get with FJs or the odd Honda engine

For the price I don’t get it, odd ball engine, airframe with very very old tech, advantage is it’s “new” and has a nice Garmin cockpit and a big shitter for those who can’t hold it?

I mean just get a phenom or mustang, or for a low cost of entry get a nextant and hire a second low time guy to sit in the right seat

Outside of flying people who crave “new” and have crohn's disease, I don’t get it

Guess you can enjoy your bowel movement as it skids off the runway :dancing:


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 01:33 
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Joined: 06/17/14
Posts: 4891
Post Likes: +1862
Location: KJYO
Aircraft: C-182, GA-7
Username Protected wrote:

Guess you can enjoy your bowel movement as it skids off the runway :dancing:


I see what you did there….


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 01:48 
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Joined: 03/04/13
Posts: 4281
Post Likes: +3082
Location: Hampton, VA
Username Protected wrote:

Guess you can enjoy your bowel movement as it skids off the runway :dancing:


I see what you did there….



Chit happens

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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 03:04 
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Joined: 08/16/15
Posts: 2867
Post Likes: +3576
Location: Ogden UT
Aircraft: Piper M600
Username Protected wrote:
I think it’s a nice jet, but does have some ground handling issues. And it’s pricey I wouldn’t mind having one, really nice inside. But for the same money, an M2 although less sexy is a more robust chariot. None of the light jets other than the SF50 are selling well. Where people are putting their money in the turbine 6-7 seat market, at least first quarter:

Cirrus SF50, 18
Piper M500/600, 8
TBM 910/960, 5
Citation M2, 5
Eclipse!!!!!! 2
Embraer P100, 2
Epic E1000, 2
Honda Jet, 1


Chuck, where does it say Eclipse sold 2 new jets? Are they really making new ones or are they counting refurb of the used ones?


They are considered new aircraft. With new numbers and FAA certification of the new models. I think some of the challenges are Pratt, no longer making that engine, and the avionics not being made new. Have to see what they do about that.
_________________
Chuck Ivester
Piper M600
Ogden UT


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 07:55 
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Joined: 07/14/17
Posts: 373
Post Likes: +145
Company: Finch Industries,Inc.
Location: Thomasville,NC
Aircraft: TBM900,M600
I know a Honda dealer that has 4 sold for 2023,what is the production issue,they delivered only 17 last year and 1 in the first quarter of 2023.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 28 May 2023, 08:58 
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Joined: 03/03/11
Posts: 1845
Post Likes: +1819
Aircraft: Piaggio Avanti
I thought a big toilet didn’t matter or would t be used. Every flight with pax mine is used in Piaggio. I swear even on short flights there are bombs dropped back there. It’s crazy.

I find it amazing that people who could afford a jet at 3% interest cannot at 5%. On 5mm that’s a hundred k delta annually. If that is bothersome I don’t think you will like long term jet ownership costs.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 29 May 2023, 13:50 
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Joined: 12/30/15
Posts: 714
Post Likes: +740
Location: NH; KLEB
Aircraft: M2, erstwhile G58
Username Protected wrote:

Sounds like it’s time to go to the CEOs house and start making oneself whole

“Nice ski boat, what’s that worth? I’ll take it and you still have a balance of XYZ”


I have the same view of not paying workers as slave labor


Pretty sure that however outrageous it is/was for JetIt to fall short on their obligations, the CEO is not personally responsible for corporate liabilities. A very good way to add a criminal trespass woe to whatever JetIt may owe.

Well established body of law in this country that separates individual from corporate liability.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda
PostPosted: 29 May 2023, 15:17 
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Joined: 03/04/13
Posts: 4281
Post Likes: +3082
Location: Hampton, VA
Username Protected wrote:

Sounds like it’s time to go to the CEOs house and start making oneself whole

“Nice ski boat, what’s that worth? I’ll take it and you still have a balance of XYZ”


I have the same view of not paying workers as slave labor


Pretty sure that however outrageous it is/was for JetIt to fall short on their obligations, the CEO is not personally responsible for corporate liabilities. A very good way to add a criminal trespass woe to whatever JetIt may owe.

Well established body of law in this country that separates individual from corporate liability.



And hasn’t that worked out well lol

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