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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 12:01 
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Joined: 11/16/10
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Location: Buffalo MN KCFE
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I seem to recall the commanders having an expensive spar AD or spar cracking issue?

Greg


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 12:16 
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Joined: 04/19/09
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Location: White Lake, MI (KPTK)
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I was looking at a 114 last summer and after doing some research and talking with an A&P friend, I found they have a relatively labor intensive tail inspection. That was as far as I went and started looking at Bonanzas and Barons again.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 12:46 
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TTBOMK, there was a wing spar AD years ago related to the main gear, which should have been accopmlished years ago on any flying Commander. There is also a repetitive inspection on the elevator spar.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 13:02 
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You would be surprised on parts availabilty for the 200. One guy bought all remaining parts from Rockwell. You can buy most parts still new in the box. He aldo has two low time salvage planes. Others are out there. About 100 flying 200s, great owners group. With several maintenance gurus, at 185 kts i think the meyers is the better nominal four seat plane it has more room (46” at shoulders v 43”) faster and more range, same book payload and no aft CG issues.
Landing gear is 3k per spot. Price that at textron. Meyers designed it with the most practical off the shelf components.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 14:19 
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Joined: 09/11/09
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Thanks for the info, Rocky. The 200 is certainly intriguing, too. Looking at them, and the Ryan Navion, one can only suppose they are siblings, and if not, at least kissing cousins..........is there some designer crossover there? (Haven't used my Google-foo to look, sorry).

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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 14:30 
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Username Protected wrote:
Thanks for the info, Rocky. The 200 is certainly intriguing, too. Looking at them, and the Ryan Navion, one can only suppose they are siblings, and if not, at least kissing cousins..........is there some designer crossover there? (Haven't used my Google-foo to look, sorry).

From the north amercan side cannot say if they were looking at the meyers.
The both arrived about 1946.
The meyers 145 was the father of the 200.
Though very smilar in apparance, the Navion is a good deal larger. Both have laminar flow wings.
I believe similarity was coincidental but derived fron study of WWII gain of knowledge.debatably the FW-190d was the best performing fighter of the war.
There are a lot of similarities in both designs.
The Navion actually used the P-51 airfoil.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 15:37 
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Sitting on the bench at the airport, and watching a departing commander 112 try to clear the trees at the end, is one of life‘s great spectators sports


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 15:44 
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Sitting on the bench at the airport, and watching a departing commander 112 try to clear the trees at the end, is one of life‘s great spectators sports


:coffee:

We used to do the same thing with a fellow at KPWA, in his Duke........often called for a top off, and loaded with lots of folks.........far as I know, by the time I moved on in '97, he was still on this side of the grass. Amazingly.

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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 15:47 
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Sitting on the bench at the airport, and watching a departing commander 112 try to clear the trees at the end, is one of life‘s great spectators sports


:coffee:

We used to do the same thing with a fellow at KPWA, in his Duke........often called for a top off, and loaded with lots of folks.........far as I know, by the time I moved on in '97, he was still on this side of the grass. Amazingly.

Evidently the duke driver was tsught by the blue line religious group.

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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 15:50 
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Username Protected wrote:
TTBOMK, there was a wing spar AD years ago related to the main gear, which should have been accopmlished years ago on any flying Commander. There is also a repetitive inspection on the elevator spar.


Law of primacy and all, but when I started flying in 87, they were all grounded for some AD, and that always stuck with me.

Best,
Rich


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 15:52 
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The 200 airframe has never had an AD and there has never been an in flight breakup.


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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 16:08 
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Username Protected wrote:
Law of primacy and all, but when I started flying in 87, they were all grounded for some AD, and that always stuck with me.

Best,
Rich

Lots of airplane types have had and will continue to have big-deal ADs.

All the Commanders had this fixed many years ago; there is a recurring inspection now.

Kinda like Beech V-tail ADs and spar inspections. No big deal now…

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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 16:16 
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They were the first light aircraft to be certified under Part 23.

That is why they are heavier and slower than comparable light aircraft.

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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 21:12 
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Username Protected wrote:
They were the first light aircraft to be certified under Part 23.

That is why they are heavier and slower than comparable light aircraft.


Strangely, with all that extra structure and weight to make it robust, it was shortly grounded with spar cracks and later developed elevator cracks.
And the landing gear also had more than its fair share of collapses.
I do admire the styling, they are a very good looking airplane.
My Commander story.
A few years ago (pre ADSB) on a day trip to Madeline Island, I was informed by ATC I was overtaking traffic ahead and at same altitude, a “commander 114”.
I was given a slight turn to pass on the right. After arriving at the Island, I radioed on CTAF that I was circling the island north east of airport at 2500”
In a very snarky voice the Commander pilot asked if I was lost.
I replied no, I’m just checking out the beaches.
My wife, hearing the same, asked “what’s their problem”?
I said it probably gets irritating being passed all the time like your standing still by airplanes that are 30 years older. :D
We still landed before them.

Greg


Last edited on 12 Jan 2023, 21:18, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Commander Singles
PostPosted: 12 Jan 2023, 21:17 
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FWIW, the Navion does not have a laminar flow wing, and the airfoil has a very clear under cambered shape, which makes it a good short field performer. I used to fly one many years ago.


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