We are still kicking around for a turboprop in this crazy market...

This Conquest: https://www.controller.com/listing/for-sale/212996797/1977-cessna-conquest-ii-turboprop-aircraft needs an engine OH (Likely ~250-300K) and a Phase D inspection but for around 900-950K all in I think this can be a solid plane, with two low time engines which should last us a lifetime.

The shop who plans on doing a pre-buy for me said they have not seen a 3 bladed 441 in 25 years, anybody have any experience with them?
(I would imagine they are a bit louder but also perhaps a bit faster than a 4 bladed prop as in other Garrett equipped airframes.)

Hilgard

If you are looking at twin turboprops, the 441 is my #1 choice. Outstanding airplane. Good luck with the purchase.

I wasn't aware that you could put three blade prop's on the -10 aircraft. I've only seen them with four bladed props.

I enjoyed flying with the Megitt system, but support is getting very difficult. On the one that I managed, they started having enough issues with them that they removed the system and installed a G600Txi last year. I can't remember what the pilot told me was the issue.

I see that one was the WAAS upgrades, so I would assume the Megitt system upgrade was done. It seems like it cost quite a few dollars and I'm not sure if it can still even be done today.

Have someone that knows 441's do the prebuy. There are lots of little things that can nickle and dime you to death. Many have sketchy records and getting them into shape can be an expensive adventure. Record keeping needs someone that understands the phase system (assuming you use Cessna's program) or it'll be a nightmare to keep airworthy.

In my opinion, the 441 is the ultimate personal airplane. There are not many turbine aircraft that can cruise along at FL350 sipping 370PPH (55GPH) of fuel total with 4000# of useful load for seven plus hours!

Who is doing the pre buy? There's only two shops in the world that I would have do a pre buy on that airplane and those would be Technicair Fresno or West Star Grand Junction. On a high time photo ship it would not surprise me at all to have a six figure bill to get through a D inspection on that airplane. If you're going the traditional turboprop route where the seller covers all airworthiness issues and overdue inspections uncovered by the pre buy you better make sure they are ready for that kind of bill before you put down a deposit.

WestStar had maintained the one we bought. They missed approximately 15 calendar date inspections for many years. The seller spent a lot of money getting it inspected to the point that they thought they were already at.

I've "heard" that they are not the 441 shop that they used to be... I have no other direct experience with them.

Hmmm..

I'm not a 441 expert, but I'd double check those engine model numbers. I suspect it might still have -8 engines, which have higher maintenance costs than -10s.

4 blade props add about 200 fpm and 5 knots over 3 blades, as well as lowering noise levels. It's a more efficient blade. If the 3 blades were faster you wouldn't have 95% of the fleet converting to 4 blade.

Kubick Aviation in MI will be doing the pre-buy. Jason M brought me in contact with them. They are very knowledgeable on these planes. I trust them which is really important for me.

The plane was maintained by WestStar, so hopefully there will not be big surprises. However its 45 years old so anything is possible.

Hilgard

I'm wondering if it's the Super 8 engine? Wasn't it National that did the conversions? The -10N number makes me think that. Totally a guess on my part.

I hear you but they are definitely -10's, I checked the logs.

Hilgard

Jason

Yes we are prepared to replace the Meggitt with a G600, once they give up the ghost.

Kubick will do the prebuy for us.

Hilgard

Advertised useful load seems high. Did the -10 STC come with a gross weight increase that I am not aware of?

That's not what I heard from Merlin operators who compared -10's with 3 and 4 bladed props and of course there is Mike C's voluminous writing about his MU2 experience that also states the 3 blade being faster in cruise.

I agree on the noise.

They are substantially worse according to the flightsafety docs describing the differences between the 3 and 4, I’ll see if I can dig that up. RVSM is a huge difference with -10 engines, I would send this to west star and have them do RVSM and props and the Phase. It will be expensive but then you’re done. They know how to get parts and they have many in stock, and they know how to troubleshoot the computers (one if only 3 places in the country to my knowledge). NDT found a crack in a flap and they had two extra flaps on the shelf! One thing they are not is cheap.

Straightflight in Denver can fix the camera holes, that is their primary business (sheet metal et al).

Incidentally I have a complete meggitt system with EIS if you need it.

For the Mitsubishis, the -10 converted planes with 3 blade props are considered louder and faster than those with the larger 4-blade props the turn backwards and at 1550 instead of 2000, but I don’t know if the 441 has the same type of setup. For the Mits, the 4 bladers also have the AD due to the reactionless mode harmonic common to lots of 4 bladed airplane propellers (our Raisbeck converted -135 C90A KA has the same problem).
Mine is a -10 3-blade and it is pretty loud inside. I think it’s faster than a typical 4-blade plane but I really don’t know as it’s my only Mits. 305-315kts TAS is common. I wish mine had the altitude and fuel capacity of the 441.
Good luck with the plane. The other two that might do the same would be the Merlin (but slower) and the Commander 1000.

Sorry Hilgard I didn't mean to be a party pooper. If the plane has been maintained by WS maybe it will fare fine during the pre buy. If you trust your shop and they have experience with the 441, especially some of the heavy maintenance then you should be fine. The problem I see is that most owners think their planes are perfect and then they have a freak out when the pre buy uncovers lots of overdue inspections and airworthiness issues that cost $100k to resolve (not hard on a turbine). I would just be sure there's a clear understanding in writing about who is responsible for fixing airworthiness issues uncovered during the inspection. Also be clear in writing about exactly what inspection you'll do for a pre buy. In other words, "the pre buy inspection will consist of a phase x, y, and z per the C441 MX manual rev 15" or whatever. Anyway good luck, those are amazing airplanes.