I’ve spoken to several financing companies, and they have all told me they would not write a loan for a twin turboprop older than 1990. So, that means all the TC’s, Mitts, Conquests, Cheyenne’s, etc. are off the table unless there’s a company out there I’m missing.

Does anyone know of anything? The one suggestion one of them had was to approach my local banker and they may do it. I’d prefer to use a company that does aircraft loans as part of their normal business. To be honest, I’m just torn between all the options out there aircraft-wise but the financing thing seems to limit me.

Suggestions?

Can I suggest you consider the boat you’ll be in as a seller with buyers being told that?

It is a big factor…also consider what hull values insurance will write on, and compare that to various ages of airframes

Younger = more liquid, more insurable to higher levels, and less headache to own, but of course that all comes at a price

I was shopping earlier C90 and E90 models until I really saw the light with what the banking and insurance world is screaming

I would second the advice to go to your local banker. If you have/had a home loan, or a business loan, they will see you as a valuable customer and seek to help you out. First Interstate Bank in my home town helped me out with a loan on a ‘74 turboprop and they had no concerns about the age of the plane. That was over 5 years ago and things may have changed but it allowed me to get this plane before finding a buyer for my twin piston and I subsequently paid off the loan in about 3 years, no penalty for early payment. Keep it local.

I’ve used Dorr Aviation for my 441 and MU-2 and the process was smooth both times. They arrange the loan through Tompkins Mahopac Bank.

Bob Howe
President
howe@dorraviation.com
Dorr Aviation Credit Corp.
Phone: 800-214-0066
www.dorraviation.com

Dorr is a good suggestion.

Also try Lisa McPartland at Tompkins Mahopac Bank (Brewster NY), who works with Dorr on some lending. (845) 278-1058 or email lmcpartland@tompkinsfinancial.com Worth a shot.

+2 for Dorr - They’re very easy to work with and very competitive on rates/terms.

Almost all the "aviation lenders" aren't really lenders. They are firms that package loans and sell them to others and earn fees for doing so. So, the loans have to sellable. Since the buyers of those loans aren't equipped, or interested, in underwriting the strength of the borrower, beyond a superficial level, the loan buyer wants to know that the collateral is fairly liquid and unlikely to decline in value faster than the loan.

So, old airplanes make selling the loan tough.

For buyers of difficult collateral, whether an airplane, older car, real estate that needs help, etc. lenders who will make loans for these kinds of assets need and will require the ability to look at the loan repayment capabilities, credit worthiness and character of the borrower. That kind of a lender is a bank.

Banks make their own loans and generally speaking keep them rather than selling them off in the secondary market. On older assets they may want more equity in the purchase as the risk (see above) is greater, but often they will require similar or even less depending on the borrower.

If you have a relationship with a local community bank go there. If you don't this may be your opportunity to develop one. In addition to the things you'll have to provide to any lender like tax returns you will need to be able to help the lender understand the value of the asset. That means helping them find an appraiser or other qualified value establishing expert to quantify the current market value of your airplane. This can mean increased costs compared to a broker who may not have an appraisal requirement. And you should expect to pay a slightly higher rate of interest. You may or may not have the a loan fee, which you also should expect from a broker. You will also need a personal financial statement. It's not a more difficult process but it is different.

I would add an enthusiastic endorsement of Dorr.

Nobody else was willing to even talk to me based on the age of my Stearman. Heidi and Bob were consummate professionals who brokered the load through Tomkins and Mahopac.

When I sold my 1940 Cub two years ago, I told my wife I was going to buy a newer airplane. So technically, 1942 is newer.

Winning!

+3 on Dorr. I've done several loans through them on older pistons & turboprops. They are pretty conservative on asset values, but that's because they are mostly going on your credit and cash flow ability to perform on the loan.

They're always my first call.

That said, I think there are a number of specialty lenders that will do older turboprops. The lenders (and insurance underwriters) who exclude that market tend the larger more generic ones that don't want to get their hands dirty with actually knowing the subject matter. Totally understandable - there's a niche for all.

I have no problem getting insurance coverage - that said if you want high limits of liability or are a low time pilot... different story.

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I'm really struggling with my next purchase, and seem to keep coming back to the older stuff simply because it will meet our mission requirements better than the "newer" stuff, and at a entry price point that allows for a much larger ongoing operating cost to equal out the financial equation.

Went through same problem when I determined MU2 was the right plane for me. Ended up utilizing my local bank relationship who was willing to get creative with me.

Welcome to the world of old and orphaned turboprops, led by our poster-boy Adam S. Frisch.

We occupy a small niche in aviation - fitting snuggly between crusty twin piston drivers and slicked-hair jet-jockies. Well-healed enough to buy jet fuel by the barrel yet too snug to spend hard-earned money on mafia-like engine programs. Where the glassy-eyed FBO counter-girl at first thinks we're ladened with money, then, realizing our airplanes are older than her father, tosses us aside with the Piper Commanches. We live in a purgatory between Twin-Bonanzas and the FanJet 500. It's a tough niche to fill, but we do it with honor.

That's some crisp December Brannigan-esque prose right there.

Joseph, sent you an email through Beechtalk last night. I can get some names if you would like.

Would recommend First Source Bank based in South Bend Indiana. I refinanced my 1982 C90-1 through them in October 2020 without much hassle. PM me and I will provide the contact info for the guy that handled my transaction.

RM