24 Apr 2024, 00:32 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 28 Feb 2021, 18:59 |
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Joined: 07/21/08 Posts: 5469 Post Likes: +6186 Location: Decatur, TX (XA99)
Aircraft: 1979 Bonanza A36
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Username Protected wrote: Fun to watch, skilled pilot but IMHO this shows a complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Then you most assuredly wouldn’t fly with me, or almost anyone else that do off airport operations
_________________ I'm just here for the free snacks
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 28 Feb 2021, 20:02 |
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Joined: 10/04/19 Posts: 653 Post Likes: +400 Company: Capella Partners Location: Alpine Airpark, 46U
Aircraft: P35, TW Pacer
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Username Protected wrote: Fun to watch, skilled pilot but IMHO this shows a complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Hell of a first post. Absolutely nothing about that approach or landing were even in the neighborhood of marginal. - breaker breaker - Eduardo, how do you protect the delicate pa-46 nose wheel mech in operations like that? I imagine you'd want a bit more sustained elevator back pressure and time on the main gear than the landing in the video, ideally? Or is the nosegear less of a problem than we have been led to believe? -J
_________________ PPL AMEL @jacksonholepilot on instagram firstlast@gmail.com
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 00:09 |
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Joined: 02/27/08 Posts: 3179 Post Likes: +1263 Location: Galveston, TX
Aircraft: Malibu PA46-310P
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Username Protected wrote: Fun to watch, skilled pilot but IMHO this shows a complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Then you most assuredly wouldn’t fly with me, or almost anyone else that do off airport operations
Agreed. The back country videos I see posted make the jet prop landing look lame.
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 00:50 |
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Joined: 12/03/14 Posts: 19252 Post Likes: +23622 Company: Ciholas, Inc Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
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Username Protected wrote: The back country videos I see posted make the jet prop landing look lame. If you can land on a runway, then you can precisely miss that tree on approach. Camera angles often don't tell the whole story, either, it may have not actually been very close. Mike C.
_________________ Email mikec (at) ciholas.com
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 06:13 |
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Joined: 01/11/11 Posts: 1102 Post Likes: +564 Company: FUSION
Aircraft: B300ER B200 C90 DHC6
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Username Protected wrote: complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Don, what you say in your very first post on BT is just nonsense, IMO If you are a pilot and find this so marginal, not sure who would want to fly with you! Then, according to your post, no one [and no airlines] should be operating in-&-out of KASE, TFFJ, LFLJ and many other airports.
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 09:46 |
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Joined: 03/23/08 Posts: 6961 Post Likes: +3614 Company: AssuredPartners Aerospace Phx. Location: KDVT, 46U
Aircraft: IAR823, LrJet, 240Z
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Username Protected wrote: Fun to watch, skilled pilot but IMHO this shows a complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Hell of a first post. Absolutely nothing about that approach or landing were even in the neighborhood of marginal. - breaker breaker - Eduardo, how do you protect the delicate pa-46 nose wheel mech in operations like that? I imagine you'd want a bit more sustained elevator back pressure and time on the main gear than the landing in the video, ideally? Or is the nosegear less of a problem than we have been led to believe? -J We’ve processed more FOD claims on PA46 turbines than any other model. King Air is #2 but we insure a whole lot more of them.
Delicate axial blades.
_________________ Tom Johnson-Az/Wy AssuredPartners Aerospace Insurance Tj.Johnson@AssuredPartners.com C: 602-628-2701
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 10:30 |
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Joined: 01/12/14 Posts: 35 Post Likes: +28 Location: Thailand
Aircraft: PA46-350P Jetprop
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Username Protected wrote: Fun to watch, skilled pilot but IMHO this shows a complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Hell of a first post. Absolutely nothing about that approach or landing were even in the neighborhood of marginal. - breaker breaker - Eduardo, how do you protect the delicate pa-46 nose wheel mech in operations like that? I imagine you'd want a bit more sustained elevator back pressure and time on the main gear than the landing in the video, ideally? Or is the nosegear less of a problem than we have been led to believe? -J
For such a short runway you need to bank on reverse immediately which is an all wheel down necessity. So my SOP is to plant the aircraft on. For normal runways I will hold off the nosewheel for longer and rarely use reverse under those circumstances. Historically IMHO the weakness with the piston nosewheel was the original production engine mount that was prone to structural failures at critical weld points. Rocket replaces the engine mount with a beefier version as part of the Jetprop conversion. Piper had several goes at addressing this over the years and l believe now is less of a cause. I also understand there have been a few after market engine mounts for the piston version to address the same issue.
I don't think the cause of the current M600 nosewheel collapse / runway excursions is the same problem if indeed it is discovered to be a mechanical problem.
I keep the nosewheel strut inflated higher than normal for prop clearance which helps.
I have been operating at least a dozen times a year out of that strip for the best part of seven years and apart from accelerated wear on the leading edges of the prop not suffered any other adverse effects, so continue to be comfortable using it within my own limitations.
Cheers. E
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 11:21 |
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Joined: 04/26/13 Posts: 19949 Post Likes: +19698 Location: Columbus , IN (KBAK)
Aircraft: 1968 Baron D55
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Username Protected wrote: The back country videos I see posted make the jet prop landing look lame. If you can land on a runway, then you can precisely miss that tree on approach. Camera angles often don't tell the whole story, either, it may have not actually been very close. I went back and stepped through it at quarter speed and high resolution. To be fair, it is pretty close. I'm guessing maybe ten to twenty feet vertically and offset horizontally, but part of the wing appears to be over the tree.
Attachment: image_2021-03-01_101528.png
That said, winds were light, the tree was known and easily avoided. I have no problem with the approach. As has been mentioned, there are a lot more "exciting" approaches in a lot of places. I find the comment about "no margin" interesting. What are we trying to mitigate? Windshear? Nope. Gusts? Nope. Engine failure? Turn a little or use any energy reserve to clear. Pilot error? If you are at risk of flying into that tree, you shouldn't go there.
I guess Don has never been to St. Bart.
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 01 Mar 2021, 18:14 |
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Joined: 04/20/15 Posts: 564 Post Likes: +318 Location: KFAT
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Username Protected wrote: We’ve processed more FOD claims on PA46 turbines than any other model. King Air is #2 but we insure a whole lot more of them.
Delicate axial blades. Interesting. I wonder how that'd be the case with Meridians with a full time particle separator. Ingesting FOD through the outlet at low speeds?
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 02 Mar 2021, 09:59 |
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Joined: 03/23/08 Posts: 6961 Post Likes: +3614 Company: AssuredPartners Aerospace Phx. Location: KDVT, 46U
Aircraft: IAR823, LrJet, 240Z
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Username Protected wrote: We’ve processed more FOD claims on PA46 turbines than any other model. King Air is #2 but we insure a whole lot more of them.
Delicate axial blades. Interesting. I wonder how that'd be the case with Meridians with a full time particle separator. Ingesting FOD through the outlet at low speeds? No clue. But either something in the cowling design or general proximity to earth seems to make them susceptible in my experience. Maybe we just had bad luck,
_________________ Tom Johnson-Az/Wy AssuredPartners Aerospace Insurance Tj.Johnson@AssuredPartners.com C: 602-628-2701
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 04 Mar 2021, 12:44 |
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Joined: 06/01/16 Posts: 453 Post Likes: +340 Location: Citrus County Florida
Aircraft: Shopping
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Username Protected wrote: Fun to watch, skilled pilot but IMHO this shows a complete lack of judgement. There is NO margin for error. Way too close to trees on approach. Just no margin for error. I wouldn't fly with this guy. Really? I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion, I wouldn't fly with you either. Stick to your 12,000 foot runways, and don't go anywhere near Aspen, way too dangerous, no margin for error there either.
_________________ Anthony Dennis
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Post subject: Re: Jetprop Grass Strip Porn Posted: 04 Mar 2021, 16:04 |
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Joined: 08/16/15 Posts: 2899 Post Likes: +3608 Location: Ogden UT
Aircraft: Piper M600
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Username Protected wrote: -J
We’ve processed more FOD claims on PA46 turbines than any other model. King Air is #2 but we insure a whole lot more of them. Delicate axial blades.[/quote] Curious if you see in difference between the Jet-prop and Meridian/M600. The latter 2 having full time inertial separators, the JP is pilot selectable. Also keeping in mind there are about 2.5 times as many Meridian/M500/M600's as JP's, but I imagine your company experience controls for that.
_________________ Chuck Ivester Piper M600 Ogden UT
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