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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 28 Apr 2021, 02:52 
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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 28 Apr 2021, 09:11 
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Username Protected wrote:
The Super Cub wing tempted you into perhaps shorter fields, than with hindsight, would have been wise, including grass strips.


Short fields?

[youtube]https://youtu.be/2fcEJkKt8hs[/youtube]


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 28 Apr 2021, 16:41 
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Username Protected wrote:
The Super Cub wing tempted you into perhaps shorter fields, than with hindsight, would have been wise, including grass strips.


Short fields?

[youtube]https://youtu.be/2fcEJkKt8hs[/youtube]



Wow!! Courchevel? Do you have the landing video?

Rgs,
Patrick

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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 28 Apr 2021, 18:22 
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Actually it is LFIP Peyresourde, in the Pyrénées. It is little known but believe it or not, it is the same runway than in this clip:

https://youtu.be/hcIgZ4kJ5Ow?t=414

(even though James Bond likes to take off uphill.. sorry apparently the YT embed thing doesn't work with the "jump to" parameter in the URL)

I don't have the video of the landing because I was quite focused on not messing it up :-) I've been there maybe 10 times but every time the side picture is so unusual that it takes quite a bit of bandwidth to get the power settings right.


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 28 Apr 2021, 18:33 
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Zut alors! C'est très court mon ami.


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 17 May 2021, 00:53 
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Joined: 02/25/16
Posts: 7
Aircraft: PA-27
Hi Aztec "brains trust" !

Hoping for a bit of advice regarding how best to fit multiple bicycles in an Aztec. I fly an e model and am also a keen cyclist. I'd love to be able to fit multiple bikes (ideally 3-4), plus the same number of riders to get away for some weekend fly/ride trips.

I have tried fitting a bike frame (with the wheels & seat post removed) in the rear baggage locker, but it doesn't really work and I certainly couldn't get a 2nd bike in there. I could remove the middle row seat behind the co-pilot and think that would work for 2 bikes (with wheels in the lockers) and still have seating for 2 of us. But no good access for middle or back row pax once the bikes were loaded, so therefore not safe.

Would removing the 3rd row of seats be a viable option? ie How hard is that to do and with the structure, how much extra room would that really give me for loading frames via the rear baggage door?

Would appreciate any advice. And yes, the barn doors of a 58 Baron would be great, but not on my horizon!

Thanks Ben


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 17 May 2021, 08:47 
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Username Protected wrote:
Hi Aztec "brains trust" !

Hoping for a bit of advice regarding how best to fit multiple bicycles in an Aztec. I fly an e model and am also a keen cyclist. I'd love to be able to fit multiple bikes (ideally 3-4), plus the same number of riders to get away for some weekend fly/ride trips.

I have tried fitting a bike frame (with the wheels & seat post removed) in the rear baggage locker, but it doesn't really work and I certainly couldn't get a 2nd bike in there. I could remove the middle row seat behind the co-pilot and think that would work for 2 bikes (with wheels in the lockers) and still have seating for 2 of us. But no good access for middle or back row pax once the bikes were loaded, so therefore not safe.

Would removing the 3rd row of seats be a viable option? ie How hard is that to do and with the structure, how much extra room would that really give me for loading frames via the rear baggage door?

Would appreciate any advice. And yes, the barn doors of a 58 Baron would be great, but not on my horizon!

Thanks Ben


Dude less than 5 minutes. I bet you can do 4 bikes and 4 riders that way. This is most of a reason I bought my Aztec. Top of bench seat pushes forward from rear baggage finagle and wiggle it up and forward turn it sideways pass it out back door. Bottom is two bolts. Pull it forward and twist it sideways pass it out back door. I think there are small kayaks that would fit in there with 2nd and 3rd rows out.


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 17 May 2021, 08:49 
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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 17 May 2021, 10:39 
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Location: KMMU - New Jersey
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Username Protected wrote:

Dude less than 5 minutes. I bet you can do 4 bikes and 4 riders that way. This is most of a reason I bought my Aztec. Top of bench seat pushes forward from rear baggage finagle and wiggle it up and forward turn it sideways pass it out back door. Bottom is two bolts. Pull it forward and twist it sideways pass it out back door. I think there are small kayaks that would fit in there with 2nd and 3rd rows out.


I take the middle and third row seats out all the time, over the last year to find destinations to go to I've been doing pilot's and paws flights and by removing the seats I can put dog crates easily in the cabin.

The rear bench in mine (D Model) has 2 screws accessible from the rear baggage compartment for the backrest, I remove the screws and the backrest will simply fall forward and can be lifted out. The bench I find a little bit of a PITA, there are two keyhole slots on the floor, you need to pull the bench forward while lifting up and hope it lines up right within the keyhole slot.

You can get the rear seat out of rear baggage door but you must turn it exactly the right way, I find it much easier and quicker to take it out the main cabin door.

Also the Flight manual for the Aztec lists the weight of the seats -

Co-pilot 23lbs arm- 89 moment 2047
Middle seat (each) 24lbs arm- 126 Moment-3024
rear bench (total) 26 1/2 lbs arm- 157 Moment - 4161


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 17 May 2021, 11:14 
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Let’s see dogs in Aztec mine is dog hauling machine, ugly carpet original upholstery dog friendly
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On way to grouse hunt. Other dog on floor. Gordon setters


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 17 May 2021, 18:29 
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Jeff & Jacob - thanks guys, that is awesome to know, I'll give it a go.


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 02 Nov 2021, 22:34 
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Hey guys, keen to hear other owner's "hot start" technique for the Aztec (ideally NA engines). Specifically between 20-60 mins after landing (eg a fuel stop) on a hot day. My technique is working "OK" but I wouldn't say I've nailed hot starts on this aircraft yet.
What I am doing currently;
1) throttles / mixture full forward
2) Hit the electric fuel pump until the fuel pressure starts to move, then pumps off.
3) Leave throttle wide open, mixture idle cut off (or slightly forward of ICO)
4) Crank and "do the hand dance" when it fires to enrichen mixture and get the throttle back to idle.

This is the technique my partner in the plane uses and has done so for the past 10 years (though probably doesn't do many 'fuel stop' hot starts). It does differ from the aircraft operating manual which says no electric fuel pump, throttle cracked 1/2 inch and mixture ICO, then richen mixture when the engine fires.


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 03 Nov 2021, 07:57 
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I e never had an engine start hot as easily as my Aztec, I follow the manual like you said throttle half inch, idle cut off, no electric pump and I have success 99% of the time. I use same procedure for any start after it’s been running recently, say my wife forgot the phone or kid has to pee just after startup so even relatively cold it works well for me.



I have had it not work before when blazing hot in the south, at that time I’ve run electric pump with mixture at idle cutoff and it’s worked 2nd time.


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 03 Nov 2021, 19:47 
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Thanks Jacob, I appreciate your insight. When you do run the pump when it is really hot, do you leave it on during the start, or just on then off?


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 Post subject: Re: The Piper Aztec/Apache thread
PostPosted: 03 Nov 2021, 21:00 
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Location: KFXE
Username Protected wrote:
Hey guys, keen to hear other owner's "hot start" technique for the Aztec (ideally NA engines). Specifically between 20-60 mins after landing (eg a fuel stop) on a hot day. My technique is working "OK" but I wouldn't say I've nailed hot starts on this aircraft yet.
What I am doing currently;
1) throttles / mixture full forward
2) Hit the electric fuel pump until the fuel pressure starts to move, then pumps off.
3) Leave throttle wide open, mixture idle cut off (or slightly forward of ICO)
4) Crank and "do the hand dance" when it fires to enrichen mixture and get the throttle back to idle.

This is the technique my partner in the plane uses and has done so for the past 10 years (though probably doesn't do many 'fuel stop' hot starts). It does differ from the aircraft operating manual which says no electric fuel pump, throttle cracked 1/2 inch and mixture ICO, then richen mixture when the engine fires.

Open the oil filler doors upon shut down. That lets out the heat that will otherwise boil all the fuel out of the injector lines, and flood the engine. Close them on preflight, and the plane will start easily.

_________________
A&P/IA/CFI/avionics tech KFXE


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