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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 04 Aug 2021, 19:17 
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… and the technical problem may result in launch scheduling problems:

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/08 ... uncertain/

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 04 Aug 2021, 19:52 
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Boeing Starliner launch delayed indefinitely due to the unknown issues related to propulsion system control. Zero chance of launch today as was previously held out as a possibility.

Boeing's haplessness continues. NASA is probably happy they picked SpaceX for the next generation moon lander contract.

https://www.space.com/boeing-starliner-launch-delayed-indefinitely


In fairness, Boeing hasn’t blown up any rockets yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 04 Aug 2021, 21:56 
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In fairness, Boeing hasn’t blown up any rockets yet.

Probably why their sh!t don’t work yet… too timid.

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 04 Aug 2021, 22:37 
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More than 1 1/2 years later after failed to achieve proper orbit and 2 years behind SpaceX - another try to launch unmanned Starliner to actually achieve ISS orbit and docking.
https://www.space.com/news/live/boeing-starliner-oft-2-live-updates
What changed?..Boeing hired its first software engineering vice president at the company after all the software, communication and control related disasters in both space and commercial divisions.....
https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/07/27/whats-changed-since-boeings-last-attempt-to-send-starliner-to-the-space-station/#//

Boeing posted a surprise profit but Shareholders Equity (actually a huge deficit) is $-16.7 Billion on a book basis.


Leveraged! I wonder how many other large cap companies balance sheets show huge debit equity?


Thats not what was said.

Quote:
Boeing posted a surprise profit but Shareholders Equity (actually a huge deficit) is $-16.7 Billion on a book basis.


It means Boeing (like most big companies) had a WAD of cash and bought back shares. Fewer Shareholder positions, lower shareholder equity. Boeing now has less Cash and more Capital than it did.

Large Corporations operate thier shares to maintain a constant or greater Value Position. If you have lots of cash and the GoV. is printing more, Buy or build bricks and mortar.....or buy back shares to prop up your share value.
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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 04 Aug 2021, 23:53 
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“Thats not what was said.

Boeing posted a surprise profit but Shareholders Equity (actually a huge deficit) is $-16.7 Billion on a book basis

It means Boeing (like most big companies) had a WAD of cash and bought back shares. Fewer Shareholder positions, lower shareholder equity. Boeing now has less Cash and more Capital than it did.

Large Corporations operate thier shares to maintain a constant or greater Value Position. If you have lots of cash and the GoV. is printing more, Buy or build bricks and mortar.....or buy back shares to prop up your share value.”

Negative equity is a Debit balance. Positive equity should be a credit balance on the balance sheet. The ONLY WAY an equity deficit can occur is if liabilities EXCEED assets(aka leveraged). The accounting equation: Assets(Debit) = Liabilities + Equity(Credit). Boeing’s purchasing treasury stock is like putting lipstick on a pig. It doesn’t change the fact it’s still a pig. Boeing needs to concentrate on quality product and not the FMV of the company stock at the moment


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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2021, 11:04 
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Username Protected wrote:
“Thats not what was said.

Boeing posted a surprise profit but Shareholders Equity (actually a huge deficit) is $-16.7 Billion on a book basis

It means Boeing (like most big companies) had a WAD of cash and bought back shares. Fewer Shareholder positions, lower shareholder equity. Boeing now has less Cash and more Capital than it did.

Large Corporations operate thier shares to maintain a constant or greater Value Position. If you have lots of cash and the GoV. is printing more, Buy or build bricks and mortar.....or buy back shares to prop up your share value.”

Negative equity is a Debit balance. Positive equity should be a credit balance on the balance sheet. The ONLY WAY an equity deficit can occur is if liabilities EXCEED assets(aka leveraged). The accounting equation: Assets(Debit) = Liabilities + Equity(Credit). Boeing’s purchasing treasury stock is like putting lipstick on a pig. It doesn’t change the fact it’s still a pig. Boeing needs to concentrate on quality product and not the FMV of the company stock at the moment

Agreed. No doubt Boeing used an incredible amount of cash to buy back a ton of stock over the last 15 years. Today they have over $42 bil. in net debt ( net of cash and short term investments) and $18 bil. in Retiree Medical and Pension plan liability. - (I bet the retiree medical liability grows over time too.).

If you look at Operating Cash Flow from the base business you see it is negative. - It’s not generating cash -It continues to consume cash. Op Cash Flow in Q2 of 2021 was negative $(0.5) Bil. and for the first 6 months of 2021 was negative $(3.9) bil. And that is before spending on new PPE - plant, property and equipment - that runs about $1.5 bil. Per year. And let’s not forget that Boeing stopped paying their $8.20 dividend/share in 2020. On nearly 600 million shares that is another $4.8 bil. Cash outflow that the shareholders expect to be reinstated.

The only thing keeping Boeing going right now is financing.

The investors expect the company to return to cash profitability (generating cash - not just “book profit”). That’s what keeps the stock where it is even at its current depressed price ($228/share currently vs $380/share September 2019). Does an indefinite delay on the launch of Starliner impact stock? NO - because shareholders never expect it to make money. It is more of a showpiece, glory, bragging right effort. It’s not like it is a building block in a chain to build or deploy a real positive cash flowing business - like SpaceX is doing by reusing and leveraging old Falcon 9 rockets from Dragon and Crew Dragon to keep the cost of deployment down on Starlink. I bet Boeing shareholders are just happy that Starliner is not losing more money.


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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2021, 17:36 
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In fairness, Boeing hasn’t blown up any rockets yet.

They're not using a Boeing rocket.

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2021, 17:43 
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In fairness, Boeing hasn’t blown up any rockets yet.

They're not using a Boeing rocket.


They’re using a Lockheed Martin booster. But the Delta IV (from Boeing, nee MD, now ULA same as the Atlas) hasn’t blown up either.

But not blowing up isn’t exactly the only criterion of success, I’ll grant that.
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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2021, 22:48 
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But not blowing up isn’t exactly the only criterion of success, I’ll grant that.

It’s a very low bar, and so far Starliner has tripped over every higher one.

It would take a lot of proving flights before I’d go for a ride in that. I’d take a ride in Dragon in a second.

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 10 Aug 2021, 10:37 
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https://www.newsweek.com/timeline-boeing-starliner-problems-nasa-eyes-mid-august-launch-1617792

Timeline of problems for Boeing. Mid-August launch.....maybe.


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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 10 Aug 2021, 14:23 
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I didn't see the mid-August guess, but I'm thinking that's pretty optimistic. Even if they find and fix the problem tomorrow they still have to re-stack the vehicle on the booster and roll it out to the pad. In Boeing/NASA time, that would be about two months.

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 10 Aug 2021, 15:22 
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But not blowing up isn’t exactly the only criterion of success, I’ll grant that.

It would be just like Boeing's luck if the booster had a catastrophic failure completely unrelated to the Starliner.

The average Joe won't know the difference and will assume the Starliner failed.

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 10 Aug 2021, 17:16 
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It seems that the Starliner problems are more significant than Boeing first reported. It was not that valve positions were incorrectly reported, 13 valves failed to open:

https://gizmodo.com/what-in-the-hell-is ... 1847457012

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 10 Aug 2021, 19:59 
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It seems that the Starliner problems are more significant than Boeing first reported. It was not that valve positions were incorrectly reported, 13 valves failed to open:

https://gizmodo.com/what-in-the-hell-is ... 1847457012


6 more to go… :duck:

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 Post subject: Re: Boeing Starliner: 80 Problems
PostPosted: 10 Aug 2021, 22:20 
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It was not that valve positions were incorrectly reported, 13 valves failed to open:

I smell software.

If Boeing calls me to be the first passenger on Starliner, I'm not going.

If SpaceX calls me for Dragon, I'll be packed in seconds.

Mike C.

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