What are the main differences between these piper models? Is the Matrix the unpressurized version? What is different between the Malibu and Mirage if they are both pressurized? Why aren't these planes more popular? They seem very capable for what they are.

Matrix is unpressurized, and has a lycoming power plant. Mirage is pressurized, with the lycoming powerplant. The Malibu is the original Pa-46 and has the continental powerplant. To the contrary, they are a VERY popular aircraft.

They are popular. They are great.

New ones lack useful load and are only available with Lycoming engine. At one time 1/10 mirages had experienced an engine failure. Class action lawsuit was filed. They have low useful load, have a long wing that does not fit in most T hangars, and guzzle has compared to a Malibu.

They Malibu is the better aircraft overall. Higher useful load. Same long wing issue.

If you have a mission than involves getting high and carrying a few people, they are great.

A36 does all of this except pressurization. It also has barn doors if you need to load cargo.

The pressurization system is one of the best in GA.

Were the engine failures with Lycoming engines? What was causing them to fail?

Early model Malibu’s definitely have more useful load. Mine is 1438lbs after a major avionics upgrade. UL is lower on the Mirage, but still workable. They carry a lot of fuel and have six seats, you can’t fill both. Cockpit is tight, especially on earlier models. It does not fit everyone.

I have owned mine over two years and I am impressed every time I fly it. To fly five people over 1000nm direct to the Bahamas from my house at 203kts burning 15.5gph 23k is amazing to me. I have never seen my wife so happy and comfortable in an airplane.

Kevin

Geesh. Thanks for giving me a reason to consider upgrading from the Toga.

Didn't the mirage get significant air frame improvements...specifically the wing structure?

Kevin, do you cut across the Gulf??

These planes (PA 46) are very popular and still produced new today (now called M350). Been in production for close to 37 years to back up the 'popular' comment.

Malibu / Mirage / M350 easier (to me) to think of as year produced.

Started as a Malibu with a continental 310 hp Year 1984 - 1988

Moved to a Mirage in 1989 with a lycoming 350 hp engine (same engine in the now M350)

As noted, matrix is a non-pressurized version of the mirage and no longer in production.

The engine issues mentioned, while did exist 30 years ago, are not applicable to the fleet. Also from the data I have seen it was NO WHERE close to 1/10 aircraft. That always seems to float in cyberspace but not grounded in fact. There was an issue with understanding running LOP operations which lead to engine issues with the continental (hence the move to lycoming)

Overall they are complicated machines that require careful attention to proper maintenance. If that falls off problems will occur.

As for useful load, like most 6 seat aircraft it cannot fill all 6 seats and full fuel. But useful load as a # (people or fuel) it is very respectable.

The wing structure change happened in 1999, and was related to the Meridian coming out than a need for a structural change in the Mirage wing itself.

Do you have pictures of yours? Is yours pressurized?

People do seem to worry about the engines. Not sure that is really about the engine itself. Rather, most airplanes above $X have either a turbine engine or a parachute. The Malibu/Mirage doesn’t.

For a lot of pilots, there’s a dividing line between a plane that fits in a T hangar and one that doesn’t. It feels easy to trade one plane for another when they both fit in the same hangar at the same airport. Moving up to the Malibu forces a move up to a bigger hangar, which in some areas means moving airports to find one available or going to a shared hangar which brings a different set of issues.

Without pressurization it would be about like an A36. Is the pressurized tube really needed?

Useful perspective; thanks. Would be interesting to compare 350 to 500 in terms of total cost of ownership — say for early 2000 models. Somehow it seems that the SETP premium would be worth it, if only to fly something different (bucket list item).

Best,

Tom

Do you have pictures of yours? Is yours pressurized?

[quote="Kevin Gabriel"][quote="Michael Miller"][quote="Kevin Gabriel"]Early model Malibu’s definitely have more useful load. Mine is 1438lbs after a major avionics upgrade. UL is lower on the Mirage, but still workable. They carry a lot of fuel and have six seats, you can’t fill both. Cockpit is tight, especially on earlier models. It does not fit everyone.

I have owned mine over two years and I am impressed every time I fly it. To fly five people over 1000nm direct to the Bahamas from my house at 203kts burning 15.5gph 23k is amazing to me.
Does the heater struggle at altitude? What was insurance cost to go from a Bo to a malibu?