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18 Apr 2024, 08:57 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 15 Feb 2020, 02:21 
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Joined: 01/01/10
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ProParts is a program that essentially covers the whole airplane including consumables. In the early years ProParts was a good deal. Today, not so much.

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 15 Feb 2020, 06:22 
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Joined: 08/24/13
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Company: Aviation Tools / CCX
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Or a P300...….annual inspection, goes like a bat outta hell to 45k, goes the distance, and there is one under 5mm that's going to prebuy.


Congrats!


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 15 Feb 2020, 15:29 
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Username Protected wrote:
ProParts is a program that essentially covers the whole airplane including consumables. In the early years ProParts was a good deal. Today, not so much.

What is the hourly (or monthly/yearly) cost for the ProParts program for a Mustang?

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 15 Feb 2020, 15:35 
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Joined: 05/29/13
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Company: Easy Ice, LLC
Location: Marquette, Michigan; Scottsdale, AZ, Telluride
Aircraft: C510,C185,C310,R66
Username Protected wrote:
ProParts is a program that essentially covers the whole airplane including consumables. In the early years ProParts was a good deal. Today, not so much.

What is the hourly (or monthly/yearly) cost for the ProParts program for a Mustang?


Parts $184/hr
engines $154/hr
protech $268/hr
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Power of the Turbine
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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 15 Feb 2020, 15:53 
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Username Protected wrote:
What is the hourly (or monthly/yearly) cost for the ProParts program for a Mustang?


Parts $184/hr
engines $154/hr
protech $268/hr

Sorry for being ignorant, but what is protech for? And I assume that the $154/hr for engines is for both?

TIA
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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 15 Feb 2020, 16:17 
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Username Protected wrote:
Parts $184/hr
engines $154/hr
protech $268/hr

Sorry for being ignorant, but what is protech for? And I assume that the $154/hr for engines is for both?

TIA

Disregard, found the info on Cessna's site.
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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 09:17 
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Joined: 11/07/11
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Location: KBED, KCRE
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Made this on Thursday. Flying an arrival and approach into KAPA. It’s long. Maybe boring.

[youtube]https://youtu.be/nHnj2ay4ng0[/youtube]

Controller: Traffic, 1:00.
Pilot: Can't see them, but I'm all caught up on Stranger Things.

Chip-


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 09:51 
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Joined: 12/16/09
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Disregard, found the info on Cessna's site.
Please go ahead and post the information here for the rest of us so that this can become the definitive Citation Mustang thread.

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 10:32 
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Joined: 01/27/18
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Location: South NorthEast West Virginia :)
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Username Protected wrote:
Made this on Thursday. Flying an arrival and approach into KAPA. It’s long. Maybe boring.


Mark, great video! Thanks. Not boring at all to this VFR PA28 pilot. Made me feel like I was mixing it up with the big boys. :D Love your co-pilot.


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 12:25 
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Username Protected wrote:
--------------------
From Mark Hangen:

Parts $184/hr
engines $154/hr
protech $268/hr
--------------------
Sorry for being ignorant, but what is protech for? And I assume that the $154/hr for engines is for both?
TIA

Disregard, found the info on Cessna's site.
Please go ahead and post the information here for the rest of us so that this can become the definitive Citation Mustang thread.

https://txtav.com/en/service/programs

ProTech locks in labor costs for both scheduled and unscheduled maintenance, based on the consumer price index, stabilizing them during the contract term.

Eligible Aircraft
Cessna Citation® Mustang®-510
Cessna Citation CJ, CJ1+, M2, CJ2+, CJ3+, CJ4 – 525
Cessna Citation, Excel, XLS+ (MSG-3 Aircraft) – 560
Cessna Citation, Encore(+) – 560
Cessna Citation, Ultra – 560
Cessna Citation, Bravo – 500B
Cessna Citation, II – 550
Cessna Citation, V – 560
Cessna Citation Sovereign+ – 680
Cessna Citation Latitude – 680A
Cessna Citation X+ (MSG-3 Aircraft) – 750

Standard Program Coverage

Inspection document tasks
Engine minor inspections
Engine R&I for scheduled maintenance (includes rental R&I)
Engine R&I for unscheduled maintenance
Mandatory service bulletins
Unscheduled maintenance
Platinum cleaning every third year
Consumable servicing labor
Shop charges
MSU/field trip travel time and expense (must be AOG)

Program Features and Benefits

Contracted hourly rate adjusted annually by CPI-W
Predetermined hourly rate based upon annual utilization
No enrollment fees for new aircraft
Maintenance at Textron Aviation company-owned service center and participating authorized Textron Aviation service facilities
Simple administration
Assignable with Textron Aviation approval

Program Terms & Stipulations

New aircraft: 5 years/3,000 hrs
Used aircraft: 3 years/1,800 hrs
Renewal: 3 years/1,800 hours
Enrollment in ProParts
Open account in good standing with Textron Aviation

Used Aircraft Enrollment Preconditions

Aircraft inspection may be required
Enrollment fee based on aircraft age, flight hours and maintenance history

Program Exclusions

Freight, taxes and duties
Labor due to corrosion, neglect or damage
Discretionary labor
Maintenance to or resulting from non-approved parts installation
Labor due to consequential damage
Engine washes
Out-of-warranty structural parts labor (frames, stingers, ribs, spars, skins, etc.)
Wi-Fi systems
Interior upholstery, cabinetry and entertainment equipment repairs
Paint labor (other than minor touch-ups)
Labor to perform hydrostatic tests for oxygen, nitrogen fire extinguisher cylinder
Recommended and optional service bulletin labor
Applicable inspection documents (14-day clean and inspection)
Engine shop labor for scheduled and unscheduled engine events
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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 12:34 
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Seems like if you comine pro parts, pro tech and the engine programs, your plane maintenance is 90%+ paid for? Is that right, Mark or Clint?

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 12:42 
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I would just change the title a little. I would reword it to if you have a jet mission, the Mustang is just about perfect. Might seem like semantics, but as someone who has really looked at getting a Mustang several times through the years....

My take on it, is it really shines when you need to fly far and fast, and can get high. The perfect trip is 750 nm from nice runway to nice runway. On short, low altitude missions which is the norm for an owner pilot, it is not so perfect. If your missions are mixed, like a lot of GA owner pilots, and involve shorter flights, Training flights, hamburger runs, short fields, high, hot, short fields, contaminated runways, it just not the best tool. Is a nice aircraft though. ;-).

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Ogden UT


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 12:50 
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really watching...

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 12:56 
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Location: NH; KLEB
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Username Protected wrote:
I would just change the title a little. I would reword it to if you have a jet mission, the Mustang is just about perfect. Might seem like semantics, but as someone who has really looked at getting a Mustang several times through the years....

My take on it, is it really shines when you need to fly far and fast, and can get high. The perfect trip is 750 nm from nice runway to nice runway. On short, low altitude missions which is the norm for an owner pilot, it is not so perfect. If your missions are mixed, like a lot of GA owner pilots, and involve shorter flights, Training flights, hamburger runs, short fields, high, hot, short fields, contaminated runways, it just not the best tool. Is a nice aircraft though. ;-).



Not sure that I agree entirely on the re-wording. In some ways, defining the mission by the type of aircraft defeats the purpose of defining the mission and then choosing amongst airframes that fit the mission.

We were originally looking at King Air 90/250 as an upgrade. But was encouraged by the Textron sales gent in the Northeast, to at least consider the M2. I was very reluctant at first. But the more I looked at it, the more it made sense to look at a light jet vs a turbo prop. Turbo props have great advantage for shorter legs, hauling more stuff/people, short runways and contaminated runways. But the light jets do a great job when it comes to speed and getting there if you don't need to haul a lot of stuff or people.

Surprisingly, when looking at cost per nm, the at right around 300nm, about a $0.20 cost advantage C90 vs M2; $0.10 cost advantage KA250 vs M2. At around 600nm, the M2 has a $0.19 cost advantage over the C90 and about a $0.23 cost advantage over the KA250. Please don't hold me to the pennies. The point is that the light jets only have a small cost penalty to the twin turbo props at 300nm and somewhere between 300nm and 600nm, the advantage goes to the small jets. (I know that these are M2 #s and not Mustang #s but again point is that the crossover point may be shorter than one thinks.)

Of course the SETP will have a different cost profile an likely and advantage that carries farther than 300nm. But in comparing twin turbos vs small jets, the crossover point on legs and economics was shorter than I thought.


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 17 Feb 2020, 13:15 
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Some of it does depend on how you are paying for it, who is paying for it, Tax implications, and the timeline. And yes, I was thinking about it from a perspective of a single engine turbo prop. A similar sized single turbo prop is going to run about 1/3 to 1/2 per hour doing an apples to apples comparison. Since all mustangs now are used, you would have to compare used apples. ;-)

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