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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 13 Jun 2021, 19:53 
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Bigger difference than performance would maybe be the "525" cabin vs 510 cabin?

-J

The M2 fuselage has 3” more diameter and another foot of length in the cabin.

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 14 Jun 2021, 05:31 
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Joined: 09/05/09
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that's pretty substantial...

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 11 Oct 2021, 19:45 
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Username Protected wrote:
Bigger difference than performance would maybe be the "525" cabin vs 510 cabin?

-J

The M2 fuselage has 3” more diameter and another foot of length in the cabin.


Somehow I missed this... the M2 is a lot bigger than the Mustang!
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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 11 Oct 2021, 20:08 
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Joined: 07/28/15
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Aircraft: C510
I have been flying a Mustang for the past year and instead of doing my recurrent in the Mustang this winter, I have decided to get typed on an M2 that I can dry lease. That way, I can choose between the Mustang for shorter trips (<1400NM for me is 'shorter') and M2 for slightly longer trips (e.g., my frequent CA->FL and back trips).

Going back and forth between the two, the cabin is obviously larger in the M2 and it is a superior passenger experience, it's very nice going 400+ KTS instead of 340-350 (although ATC still treats you like a speed bump), the extra range is nice but it's not a huge increase, climb performance is noticeably improved especially up high on warmer days where getting to high 30s or FL410 is not an issue at all. The G3000 avionics are a nice upgrade over G1000 NXi and automate more of the no-brainer things (like vspeeds, destination field elevation/pressurization, etc..). I haven't used the hot wings in anger yet but they sure look cooler than the Mustang's boots. And the best part is a legit big airplane PAX Safety ding in the cabin plus a PA system that allows you to annoy your family in the back with "aaaahhhh... this is your captain speaking" announcements.

Some of the downsides of the M2: It certainly sucks more fuel. The cockpit is cramped for me (I'm 6'6") while the Mustang is quite comfortable. It's a bit more of a pain to park/maneuver on the ground. The pedestal yoke is in strange position for me and I find that I am a little less precise in pitch because of the way my arms are angled - it would be great for someone with T-rex arms. The systems are just different enough to be familiar with a few gotchas... (like the ground flaps that are part of landing but must be retracted prior to doing much taxiing and the deicing systems/requirements.

Overall I like both airplanes and you can't go wrong with either. Plus with the new M2 Gen2 now you get USB-A ports and some stuff... How innovative!!


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 11 Oct 2021, 21:55 
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Joined: 05/29/13
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Company: Easy Ice, LLC
Location: Marquette, Michigan; Scottsdale, AZ, Telluride
Aircraft: C510,C185,C310,R66
The G1000 NXI with latest software closes the G3000 gap. FYI

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 06:13 
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what are the basics of the M2 profile?

seats (real-life, not actual seatbelts), luggage, and range? fuel burn? what are they selling for?

they sure do look nice on the ramp...

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 11:38 
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I used a favorable jet stream last weekend to fly from PHX-PDK non-stop in the Mustang. I used ABQ and TUL to gain tailwind. It added some distance but reduced the time and fuel to 3.8 hours and 1,970 lbs on the 1435nm route. Landed with 750 lbs. I’m sure I’ll get to pay it back on the return, but it was a fun non-stop flight to Atlanta in the Mustang.

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 12:49 
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Username Protected wrote:
The G1000 NXI with latest software closes the G3000 gap. FYI


I think it closes some of the gap but not all of it. The NXi is definitely an upgrade over the G1000, but the G3000 is really at a different level, at least in my personal opinion. Much more flexible and intuitive (at least to me). If I was getting a Mustang, I would definitely spring for the NXi upgrade ... but now with a few hundred hours behind a G3000, it will be tough to go back to a G1000 interface. Different flavors of ice cream and just one pilot's subjective opinion; YMMV.

Having said all that, I like the G1000 NXi and it's coming in my Diamond DA62, which I will be happy to fly. But all other things being equal, I do think the G3000 is a better mousetrap, especially for a turbine in the flight levels.

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 17:22 
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Joined: 05/23/13
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Username Protected wrote:
what are the basics of the M2 profile?

seats (real-life, not actual seatbelts), luggage, and range? fuel burn? what are they selling for?

they sure do look nice on the ramp...


We have a client in an M2 now, in fact just talked to him today, he loves it!

Here's my "book knowledge" maybe someone can chime in with some real world.

It's four people, comfortable, plus 1 side seat that isn't bad. Normal bags with five souls (including pilot) and it's 1000nm maybe a tad more. Fuel burn is probably 120 - 130 gals an hour.

As far as pricing, the low end in that market is typically $3M and I'm guessing north of $5M for a new one, though I haven't talked to Textron since we bought the last one.

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 17:35 
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$ 5.85 million for a new M2 Gen2 announced today at NBAA.


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 17:52 
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Joined: 07/28/15
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Aircraft: C510
Username Protected wrote:
what are the basics of the M2 profile?

seats (real-life, not actual seatbelts), luggage, and range? fuel burn? what are they selling for?

they sure do look nice on the ramp...


We have a client in an M2 now, in fact just talked to him today, he loves it!

Here's my "book knowledge" maybe someone can chime in with some real world.

It's four people, comfortable, plus 1 side seat that isn't bad. Normal bags with five souls (including pilot) and it's 1000nm maybe a tad more. Fuel burn is probably 120 - 130 gals an hour.

As far as pricing, the low end in that market is typically $3M and I'm guessing north of $5M for a new one, though I haven't talked to Textron since we bought the last one.


About right.. Officially it's 8 seats but comfortable for 6 (no one sitting on the belted potty or side facing seat). Luggage is pretty similar to the Mustang but rear compartment is actually a bit smaller. Weight and balance a little more sensitive - it generally requires some baggage/ballast in front compartment when single pilot.

Fuel burn in cruise is around 100-140 GPH depending on altitude - for example, last flight I was doing Mach 0.70 at FL370 burning 870 PPH = 130 GPH (see picture below).

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 12 Oct 2021, 20:22 
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Joined: 05/08/13
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Company: Citation Jet Exchange
Location: St. Louis
Aircraft: 58P C510 C525 Excel
We manage both an M2 and Mustang. The M2 will do 400 knots all day long at any altitude (MCT of course). 395 if it's hot and high, 405 lighter and a little lower. We've done 6 pax 550NM and just kids on board 950NM into a small headwind, and LAX to STL nonstop with 3 pax and a little tailwind (1300NM). We block about 130GPH, realistically a little lower due to the long legs.

-Citation Jet Exchange

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 13 Oct 2021, 15:20 
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Joined: 02/18/18
Posts: 16
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Company: Personal
Aircraft: C90BXP
What’s the used mustang market look like today for all the brokers on here ? Maybe looking to upgrade my c90b and mustang fits my mission well.


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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 13 Oct 2021, 15:51 
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Joined: 05/29/13
Posts: 13578
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Company: Easy Ice, LLC
Location: Marquette, Michigan; Scottsdale, AZ, Telluride
Aircraft: C510,C185,C310,R66
Username Protected wrote:
What’s the used mustang market look like today for all the brokers on here ? Maybe looking to upgrade my c90b and mustang fits my mission well.


In a phrase - damn near impossible to find

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 Post subject: Re: If the Mustang does your mission, it's darn near perfect
PostPosted: 13 Oct 2021, 16:47 
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Joined: 05/08/13
Posts: 437
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Company: Citation Jet Exchange
Location: St. Louis
Aircraft: 58P C510 C525 Excel
Mustang hasn't been too hard to find, a fair amount of people upgrade out of them.

CJX

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