01 May 2025, 16:58 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 23 Jan 2025, 19:06 |
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Joined: 01/07/21 Posts: 404 Post Likes: +391
Aircraft: M20J/R, Sr22, SR20
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https://airfactsjournal.com/2025/01/the-pros-and-the-cons-cirrus-sr22/Great article online at Air facts Journal about Cirrus SR’s. I know there are a lot of Cirrus haters here but thought it was worth a read. Maybe a new topic here. This article however was timely as I was talking to a friend of mine who just sold his company and is looking to get a new airplane. He has a 182 with G1000/KFC AP (KFC is junk for that airframe and avionics) and wants to go a bit faster and travel more. He and I were talking about his mission, budget, etc, and he wants a plane that can easily do 300-600 miles nonstop all day, and quickly and comfortably. He lives in New York and will battle winter weather more than summer weather. He’s got 2000+ hours, no ME rating though, with 1500+ in the 182. I’m like dude, you need to get a Meridian, go high, go fast and it’s relatively economical. Or for less $’s reach out to Tarver (he doesn’t know who Mike is and asked, who?) and buy a jet. He said he doesn’t want a jet. He is 68 and doesn’t want the training and insurance. So my opinion was the Meridian or another $750K to $1M SETP is perfect for his mission. He doesn’t really want a turbine for some reason and thinks a high-performance SE is best option, less training, more use. Now, I know he could fly at SETP, and he know he can fly a SETP but for some reason he doesn’t believe it’s his right option. He's been in my SR20/22 and both my Mooney’s. I told him buy a late model Cirrus SR22T with FIKI, and you’re done. Relatively fast, economical, safe, can do that mission and you can be flying it quickly, and insurance won’t be crazy. John’s article I think is sealing the deal for him and we’re going to be looking together. BTW, for those that poo poo Cirrus, I have said that both my Mooney’s were the best flying airplanes in terms of actual flying stability, control, feel, etc, that I have flown. Except the CJ’s, but they’re different. However, the Cirrus is so comfortable, roomy, great avionics and as John says, simple and a great traveling machine, that they beat the Mooney’s hands down for cross country flying, all day, every day.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 23 Jan 2025, 23:26 |
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Joined: 01/07/21 Posts: 404 Post Likes: +391
Aircraft: M20J/R, Sr22, SR20
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Username Protected wrote: Why not a Malibu/Mirage/M350? Maybe a tad faster than the Cirrus turbo, pressurized comfort, cabin class, ramp appeal befitting a newly wealthy business (former) owner. And not a turbine. He stated that a lot of what he read about engine life in Malibu/350 scare him a bit, though a Cirrus SR22T often doesn’t make it to TBO either.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 13:23 |
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Joined: 01/12/10 Posts: 519 Post Likes: +995 Location: Dallas, Texas
Aircraft: Piaggio P180, TTx
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He needs a TTx. Faster than the Cirrus, prettier than the Cirrus, stronger and better built than the Cirrus, great G2000 avionics and full FIKI. Why fly a Camry when he can have a Ferrari?  Attachment: 80B430E7-BCBA-4CE3-96DC-2E923AAD8A36IMG_0896.jpeg
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 14:42 |
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Joined: 12/03/14 Posts: 19922 Post Likes: +25000 Company: Ciholas, Inc Location: KEHR
Aircraft: C560V
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Username Protected wrote: He stated that a lot of what he read about engine life in Malibu/350 scare him a bit, though a Cirrus SR22T often doesn’t make it to TBO either. "I am worried about piston engines making TBO" "I don't want a turbine" Does not compute. Piper Meridian would be a great fit if he could get over his irrational fear of turbines and doesn't mind the capex. Maybe a JetProp? Less cost, but maybe good enough. Malibu/Mirage would be far superior to Cirrus for travel if forced into a piston single. Pressurization, even at the level the Malibu/Mirage does it, is a game changer. It reduces pilot workload by reducing fatigue and allowing more choices with weather. P210 would also be in the conversation. Mike C.
_________________ Email mikec (at) ciholas.com
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 14:49 |
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Joined: 10/07/10 Posts: 865 Post Likes: +1037
Aircraft: Pitts S-2B
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Username Protected wrote: Attachment: photo-of-gorgeous-Ferrari-and-some-kind-of-airplane-dot-jpeg It's not often I see a photo of an airplane and a car and decide I really want the car, but I think you just did it. And that's no slight on the airplane at all. That was an interesting and informative article about the Cirrus and I get the appeal (despite only having 5 hours in an SR20-G2) but it's also interesting to see the number of comments from owners who clearly love their airplanes but have found maintenance costs to be very high. I'd be on Team Turboprop myself but if he wants it, and can afford it, then congrats on the retirement airplane.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 14:50 |
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Joined: 02/27/08 Posts: 3363 Post Likes: +1419 Location: Galveston, TX
Aircraft: Malibu PA46-310P
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Username Protected wrote: Why not a Malibu/Mirage/M350? Maybe a tad faster than the Cirrus turbo, pressurized comfort, cabin class, ramp appeal befitting a newly wealthy business (former) owner. And not a turbine. He stated that a lot of what he read about engine life in Malibu/350 scare him a bit, though a Cirrus SR22T often doesn’t make it to TBO either.
Both engines suffer the same fate. Cirrus you are dealing with more cylinders issues and the M350 is Lycoming. Both are high performance engines that rarely make TBO without some work. If he can swing a turbine that would be the way to go. Easier to fly.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 18:56 |
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Joined: 01/07/21 Posts: 404 Post Likes: +391
Aircraft: M20J/R, Sr22, SR20
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Username Protected wrote: He needs a TTx. Faster than the Cirrus, prettier than the Cirrus, stronger and better built than the Cirrus, great G2000 avionics and full FIKI. Why fly a Camry when he can have a Ferrari?  Attachment: 80B430E7-BCBA-4CE3-96DC-2E923AAD8A36IMG_0896.jpeg Wow, great photo and toys in that hanger!
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 18:58 |
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Joined: 01/07/21 Posts: 404 Post Likes: +391
Aircraft: M20J/R, Sr22, SR20
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Username Protected wrote: He stated that a lot of what he read about engine life in Malibu/350 scare him a bit, though a Cirrus SR22T often doesn’t make it to TBO either. "I am worried about piston engines making TBO" "I don't want a turbine" Does not compute. Piper Meridian would be a great fit if he could get over his irrational fear of turbines and doesn't mind the capex. Maybe a JetProp? Less cost, but maybe good enough. Malibu/Mirage would be far superior to Cirrus for travel if forced into a piston single. Pressurization, even at the level the Malibu/Mirage does it, is a game changer. It reduces pilot workload by reducing fatigue and allowing more choices with weather. P210 would also be in the conversation. Mike C.
Great poits Mike. We're meeting this weekend, I think the Meridian is the way to go for him. But it's not my money. I think he's so comfortable and knows Piston SE's so well, that any step up seems daunting. He's calling his insurance guy as well to get ideas on what insurance on SETP's, etc will really cost him.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 20:03 |
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Joined: 09/18/21 Posts: 366 Post Likes: +315
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The Cirrus is one of those planes that's not great at anything, but pretty good at everything. (Lower class of plane, but the 172 is another example.) Yes there are planes that do the same thing for less money, or more for the same money, but Cirrus has done a great job of making the airplane really easy to own. In fact the only hard part is writing the check (and it's a big check cuz they ain't cheap to fly.)
If your buddy is just looking for an easy flying experience, doesn't want to have to worry about maintenance, training, etc.... and is willing to pay for the convenience of having Cirrus take care of all that for him, then it's a great option.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 24 Jan 2025, 20:24 |
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Joined: 08/16/15 Posts: 3345 Post Likes: +4799 Location: Ogden UT
Aircraft: Piper M600
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Username Protected wrote: [He's calling his insurance guy as well to get ideas on what insurance on SETP's, etc will really cost him. If he is looking at a turbine, I have heard, second hand, some real bad information from some brokers that don't have much turbine experience. There are good ones out there. I use Jay Kennedy with assured partners, and if I wasn't so happy with Jay, I would probably use Ben Peterson I think with Sunset insurance. But before you lock in with quotes, make sure your broker has some successful turbine experience. From something recently posted, it sounds like if you are in a turbine with a good insurance relationship you can fly a turbine up into your 80's. But if you want to move up to a turbine from the piston world, you better get in before you are 70, or potentially enter the land of uninsurability. So if your friend ever wants to be in a turbine, he should do it now.
_________________ Chuck Ivester Piper M600 Ogden UT
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 25 Jan 2025, 18:03 |
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Joined: 01/07/21 Posts: 404 Post Likes: +391
Aircraft: M20J/R, Sr22, SR20
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Username Protected wrote: [He's calling his insurance guy as well to get ideas on what insurance on SETP's, etc will really cost him. If he is looking at a turbine, I have heard, second hand, some real bad information from some brokers that don't have much turbine experience. There are good ones out there. I use Jay Kennedy with assured partners, and if I wasn't so happy with Jay, I would probably use Ben Peterson I think with Sunset insurance. But before you lock in with quotes, make sure your broker has some successful turbine experience. From something recently posted, it sounds like if you are in a turbine with a good insurance relationship you can fly a turbine up into your 80's. But if you want to move up to a turbine from the piston world, you better get in before you are 70, or potentially enter the land of uninsurability. So if your friend ever wants to be in a turbine, he should do it now.
Thanks Charles. Good points all around. I used assured partners for some insurance, and I've suggested he reach out to them.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 26 Jan 2025, 18:00 |
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Joined: 01/30/09 Posts: 3612 Post Likes: +2255 Location: $ilicon Vall€y
Aircraft: Columbia 400
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If non-pressurized SR22T will do, a TTx will do it better. Yeah, I’m biased since I have one. But I’ve flown both, and between them, TTx every time.
My main complaint about the PA46 is getting in and out of it, especially the cockpit. I’m tall and once through the considerable contortions to get in the cockpit, my knee is usually jammed right in to bottom edge of the panel.
I’d rather fly the Cirrus Jet. It is way more comfortable and easier to get in and out of.
But if turbines are out, then they’re out. Taking care of an older pressurized piston airplane sometimes makes turbines look downright reasonable.
Multi-engine rating is easy to get, especially if instrument-current and proficient. To truly fight winter weather, one needs FIKI and a fire breathing twin.
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Post subject: Re: Airfacts Journal - Article and Post about Cirrus Posted: 27 Jan 2025, 16:34 |
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Joined: 01/16/10 Posts: 167 Post Likes: +93 Location: Bozeman, MT
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Username Protected wrote: Why not a Malibu/Mirage/M350? Maybe a tad faster than the Cirrus turbo, pressurized comfort, cabin class, ramp appeal befitting a newly wealthy business (former) owner. And not a turbine. I'll 2nd this. Pressurization changes everything. I have opined here and on COPA, that the Piper M series (turbine or piston) are probably the best for most if you can find hangar for one. Chuck may be able to shed more light, but based on what I see on COPA, one could argue that an M series is no more or only slightly more to operate on a per mile basis than an SR22.
_________________ _________________ Bozeman, MT (KBZN)
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