17 Apr 2024, 14:41 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 17:44 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: Certainly not asking because we don't know the airplane. In fact of all of the aircraft we acquire the Pilatus is the easiest in every way. The airplane itself is simple and straightforward. When compared to a King Air it is a walk in the park.
, man I don't believe you just wrote that in public. Actually very few of the controller listed PC12 NG's are actually for sale. Most under contract, not really airplanes correctly listed or just not for sale. I put my airplane up for sale here a few month ago when I was thinking about exiting the plane ownership biz and chartering. Found out two things. Pilatus hold there value incredible well and when I looked at the TRUE charter and fractional numbers, I can see why. I had a written offer within 5 days, but Sean Sanders, whom I'm sure you know is actively in that market and folks contact him regularly. I would also give Dave Beauvois a call down in Ft Myers. They have the new satellite service center and Dave knows about everything there is to know about the PC12. For an inspection I would use Epps or Dave Beauvios. A 2008 NG will go retail for $2.8MM-3MM depending on hours and condition. If it's less it's because there are 'things' to do on the airplane. That same NG with a 5 blade, synthetic vision, add another 100k. For each year newer tack on another 50-100k The -47's are great airplanes but the integration of the Apex with the whole airframe is worth the price of admission. It makes it a safer airplane.
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 17:44 |
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Joined: 07/19/18 Posts: 368 Post Likes: +154
Aircraft: On the hunt...
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I think my example was from a Part 121 operator so the warranty may have expired, been non-existent due to fleet buy negotiation or the number of hours being flown maybe makes HAPP unattractive. Don't know. Just a datapoint. Ah, I think it was Surfair if that of any interest.
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 17:45 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: I think my example was from a Part 121 operator so the warranty may have expired, been non-existent due to fleet buy negotiation or the number of hours being flown maybe makes HAPP unattractive. Don't know. Just a datapoint. Ah, I think it was Surfair if that of any interest. They have HAPP and MAPP. They also give you a get out jail card if you pay for the service. Garmin overall MAY be cheaper, but the HAPP/MAPP is for practically everything electronic, including servos, autopilot, you name it.
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:13 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: What is the hourly cost? Fixed price, gets cheaper the more you fly...…..
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:27 |
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Joined: 05/23/13 Posts: 6776 Post Likes: +7323 Company: Jet Acquisitions Location: Franklin, TN 615-739-9091 chip@jetacq.com
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Username Protected wrote: Certainly not asking because we don't know the airplane. In fact of all of the aircraft we acquire the Pilatus is the easiest in every way. The airplane itself is simple and straightforward. When compared to a King Air it is a walk in the park.
, man I don't believe you just wrote that in public.
Why? I think you misread what I said. Probably my use of a double negative... "it's not that we don't know.
I know the airplane and knowing the market is access to information and research. We have the information and I have two of the best researchers I've seen in my 20 years in this industry.
We go through the same market research each time, no matter Pilatus, King Air, TBM, Citation... the value of the airplane we are buying today depends on what the one that sold yesterday brought. Therefor the market changes all of the time, the research we did a few months ago is out of date.
In our preliminary work we've found 9 off market NG's, though it sounds like we will be looking at very late model airplanes and most of these are older.
I'm really surprised there is no one who has decided to just do Pilatus acquisitions. Not broker or sell airplanes, but just be a buyer's rep focused on Pilatus. If I had to start from scratch today and didn't have the level of experience that I do with a variety of airframes, that's what I would do.
I just told one of our previous clients today that I can't buy him a Conquest, I just don't know the airplanes that well and don't have the time to learn them. So, anyone who want's to get into acquisitions and do Conquest, let me know... that's the second one I've turned down in the last year or so. I'll be glad to refer that business to you!
_________________ It’s a brave new world, one where most have forgotten the old ways.
Last edited on 16 May 2019, 18:38, edited 1 time in total.
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:29 |
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Joined: 05/23/13 Posts: 6776 Post Likes: +7323 Company: Jet Acquisitions Location: Franklin, TN 615-739-9091 chip@jetacq.com
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Username Protected wrote: I would also give Dave Beauvois a call down in Ft Myers. They have the new satellite service center and Dave knows about everything there is to know about the PC12.
For an inspection I would use Epps or Dave Beauvios.
Thanks, Epps is the only shop I have a comfort level with and do not know Dave, but I'll give him a shout when the time comes. And yes you are right, the PC-12 holds it's value extremely well, I tell our clients that we are not going to "steal" one... but the other side of that coin is they will make up for it when they go to sell.
_________________ It’s a brave new world, one where most have forgotten the old ways.
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:39 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: Why? I think you misread what I said.
Nope, you may not have read what you wrote :-) Quote: I know the airplane and knowing the market is access to information and research. We have the information and I have two of the best researchers I've seen in my 20 years in this industry.
2 hours and a phone and I'll have a number within 100k of the market in any airplane. At the end of the day, for that number for a PC12, the cost to buy a good one is far cheaper than to find a deal. I did 2 prebuys on 'cheap' airplanes and walked from both. It cost me about 35k and who knows how much in time. Quote: I'm really surprised there is no one who has decided to just do Pilatus acquisitions. Not broker or sell airplanes, but just be a buyer's rep focused on Pilatus. Both Sanders and Beauvois do just that. Quote: I'll be glad to refer that business to you! I'm retired.
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:39 |
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Joined: 01/29/08 Posts: 26431 Post Likes: +13066 Location: Walterboro, SC. KRBW
Aircraft: PC12NG
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Username Protected wrote: I'm really surprised there is no one who has decided to just do Pilatus acquisitions. Not broker or sell airplanes, but just be a buyer's rep focused on Pilatus. If I had to start from scratch today and didn't have the level of experience that I do with a variety of airframes, that's what I would do.
It's probably because all NG's are the same. There aren't any after market mods like there are on KA's and old business jets. If you're a buyer and find one you like, have Epps do a pre-buy and you'll know everything about it. Write the check and done. +1 for Sean Sanders. He sold me mine and we just went to SimCom together. He's a great guy. PC12's are like Rolex's..... you never "own" one. You're just taking care of it for the next guy.
Last edited on 16 May 2019, 18:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:40 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: And yes you are right, the PC-12 holds it's value extremely well, I tell our clients that we are not going to "steal" one... but the other side of that coin is they will make up for it when they go to sell. Yup agreed. The other part of the equation is that they are IMHO a very good and safe airplane for the owner flown market. Even JC can fly one
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:49 |
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Joined: 07/19/18 Posts: 368 Post Likes: +154
Aircraft: On the hunt...
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Username Protected wrote: What is the hourly cost? Fixed price, gets cheaper the more you fly...…..
So if I fly 2000 hours per month instead of 200 I still pay the 200 hour price? I want some of that. Give us a range of prices please. Thanks.
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 18:51 |
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Joined: 01/16/11 Posts: 11105 Post Likes: +7090 Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
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Username Protected wrote: So if I fly 2000 hours per month instead of 200 I still pay the 200 hour price? I want some of that. Give us a range of prices please. Thanks. 21k per year for MAPP/HAPP. Fixed price.
_________________ ---Rusty Shoe Keeper---
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Post subject: Re: Acquisition for a PC-12NG (don't tell Jason) Posted: 16 May 2019, 19:07 |
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Joined: 05/23/13 Posts: 6776 Post Likes: +7323 Company: Jet Acquisitions Location: Franklin, TN 615-739-9091 chip@jetacq.com
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Username Protected wrote:
No... no they don't... they sell airplanes... and I assume both are very good at it but what I do and what they do is inherently different.
All brokers will do "acquisitions" but they simply can not do a GREAT job of it because it takes too much time... and when you have airplanes to sell you end up focused on answering the phone calls coming in on what you have for sale.
_________________ It’s a brave new world, one where most have forgotten the old ways.
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