Need some advice. I’m trying to decide if I want to push through on an older 180 restoration right now. I’ve got a late model citabria that I fly occasionally but I want to start teaching my 10 year old how to fly. He does a pretty good job of taking the CJ off and landing it with syn vision, but it’s time to really learn.

I can use the citabria or get the 180 going. We will be using it in a mountain area. The 180 has the Texas skyways conversion. Both panels are (or would be) nice. The citabria is full glass with aspens and the 180 would get a g3x.

My concern is the 180 would be harder to learn in, but I like the idea of being able to go somewhere with it in the backcountry. I also like the idea of sitting next to my son to help him fly instead of in the back.

Despite my preconceptions though, I’m really looking for advice or comments. It’s a good problem to have... I’ve been too busy to spend much time thinking about it, but it’s now time.

Before you suggest anything different - these are the only two in contention. Just trying to get him ready to be able to solo in a few years so I have a co-pilot...

Stick with the Citabria.
WAY easier to learn on, good manners, simple engine management.
I like the idea of student in the front, gives them confidence and better sense of being in control, just be sure they know (can feel) when you make an input.
Having to start the plane, prime, mixture etc... talk on radio, set flaps
because only they have the controls is awesome.
Makes them get slow enough for full flaps to be pulled on too.

My 13 year old daughter loves it.

Cover up ALL the f'n glass.
Let him have a tach and airspeed (or AOA)

Basic skills learned correctly will always stay with him.
(primacy of learning)

He’s got 6 years to learn to fly either one...

Citabria is undoubtedly a better trainer, though.

The Citabria is a fun plane, but the 180 will get you places...
Tough choices for sure. Such different birds.
6 years is a long way to go. Depending your mission, I would focus more on that.
Citabria are not great to go far away places, but fun to teach and do light aerobatics...
If you can teach in the Citabria, you can certainly teach him in the 180. Though the site picture is very different. Sport's car versus Suburban.

See what you would use more all around.

If you have only plane, the 180 is better. If you have many, than having a citabria is a blast, as you well know, specially if it has the bigger engine...

120% on both of those statements. I learned to fly in a Citabria and it was great. Spins, loops, and rolls were my first lesson. The fact that you can spin a CItabria makes it more attractive for a primary trainer, in my opinion. And yes, cover ALL the glass. That stuff is like kryptonite for a student. They can't take their eyes off it and will absolutely refuse to look outside the airplane. I soloed in 12 hours. I have a buddy learning in a new Cirrus and I think has like 80 hours and hasn't soloed yet...

ditto on the citabria
but I would add one suggestion - if it has aspens, cover them up. Give him airspeed, altimeter, mag compass. He needs to be flying looking outside, not in.

Not sure how tall he is or will be. Will the 180 be harder to see out of?

The 180 may take longer to learn in but you have a few years.

A Citabria is the best trainer, IMO. I learned in one, so I’m biased... but those stick and rudder/ forward slip skills made me the pilot I am. Flying a Bonanza was a pretty easy transition.

Learning to properly enter a spin and not be afraid of them is easy in a Citabria, it has enough room to be comfortable, and the visibility on landing is good for a beginner and seasoned pilot alike.

Kill the aspen, use the citabria...
My Dad taught me to fly in a J3 and a Luscomb...
I also soloed our 180 before I was old enough for PP (17 vs 16 for solo)
Enjoy!

When he turns 14 go find a good glider operation and both of you learn to fly these...
Nothing will teach basic stick and rudder skills better than a glider....

Light taildraggers make the best training airplanes. I’m training a graduating senior who has done his long xc in my Champ. At present he is making the transition to a B-33, which he’ll get is check ride in. He told his dad that it’s like going from a tricycle to a Porsche.

Start with the Citabria (cover the glass) and move to the 180 when he is proficient to ACS standards in the Citabria. If he enjoys himself and progresses well, he could solo both airplanes on his 16th birthday and take his check ride on his 17th. Good luck!

My daughters swim coach inherited a c-180 from his brothers estate and wanted to learn to fly. he did some flying with his brother however is basically starting from scratch. It has taking some time however he is getting close to his check ride. you can't go wrong with either plane. I taught my daughter to fly also and it was a blast. enjoy your time together in what ever plane you decide to go with.

What's the primary goal?

Fun..training? Citabria.

Biggest thing I've noticed teaching is that for a new student sitting on the centerline helps them get the nose "right" in turns in either direction. I also believe the stick develops a good "touch" quicker.


One old guy's opinion.

The Citabria would make the kid a better pilot due to: 1) Better stick and rudder skills via learning on a tailwheel airplane; 2) Doing some basic aerobatics. I never got the logic of not training pilots on spin recovery. Stall/spin accidents occur, and it baffles me that we don’t train pilots on how to get out of something that they very well could get into some day. Also learning how to unload an airplane when in an unusual attitude is a useful skill that com come from aerobatic training.

Thanks for the comments. Somewhat reinforcing what I was thinking. I’m not concerned with the glass, he flies right seat with me in the cj2 and he needs to be able to read that. I concur with looking outside the airplane, but there is no analog gauges in either airplane. Ultimately I want to make sure he has good stick and rudder - that will save you someday.

At the end of the day, I’m just excited he wants to learn.