A few weeks ago my CJ2 underwent some regular maintenance that was due. I told my mechanic that we were going to start doing a bunch more flying so he wanted to get everything done so I could fly though the summer without interruption. One of the things on the list was replacing the engine ignitors. When they replaced these they found that one of the side electrodes on the old ignitor was broken off so they contacted Williams and Williams wanted them to borescope the back of the engine. They found damage - lots of damage..... The piece that broke off was no bigger than a Bee-bee but it bounced around the engine on its way out. They sent me a work order that I needed to sign - $0.00 charge for this!

So the Williams team quickly came out, pulled a few 16 hour days and replaced the entire hot section of the engine. This is about 2/3 of the physical size of the engine. I pointed at one of the seems in the middle of the engine and said "from here back?", the mechanic said "no the one that is a foot forward of that"

The engine is on Tap Elite. We pay $146/hr to operate the engine so we've sent about $28K (for this engine (another 28K for the other one too)) to William's for our 190 (ish) hours that we've put on the plane. Of course I asked what this would have cost but nobody knew anything more than "expensive". I imagine the monetary units for something like this are in "houses".

I feel like I won the lottery.

Excellent. I love the level of service with virtually no competition. Good for them and you John!

Need pics and an estimate if you were not in the program in order for us to share in the joy.

I am so disappointed that I don’t have pictures. I didn’t know the extent of the work they did until it was completed. When they said Williams was coming out to do an on airplane repair, I assumed it was some minor mitigation.

An interesting tangent is what is the effect on TBO or HSI when they swap 2/3 of the engine? Legally probably nothing changed. Of course reality is otherwise.

Congratulations! The program worked as advertised and you can sleep well at night knowing you are covered for these unforeseen problems. I sure am glad I am on the program.

Did you notice anything amiss with the engine during this time? Temps, fuel flow, N1/N2 ratios, etc?

I've heard more than one story of a turbine engine with significant damage and the cockpit indications and performance don't seem significantly affected.

Was this a FADEC engine? An FJ44-3A-24? There is trend data in the FADEC, did they download it and tell you anything about it? I think owners can get the FADEC download kit and get the data themselves.

Or do you have the EEC engine, FJ44-2C? I don't think the -2C has trend data in it but could be wrong about that.

One imagines Williams is going to seek a conference with the ignitor vendor (Champion?) and see what can be done to avoid these situations.


Well, it would have been better if nothing had been wrong in the first place, but I can understand the relief that comes with this.

I've never heard a bad word about Williams service. If I own a Williams engine, I will be on the program. The program is economic leverage, but being off is worse!

Mike C.

Well... I guess they can cut open the carcass and put it on a stand as a display model. Maybe donate it to an A&P school or an engineering college.

Did you notice anything amiss with the engine during this time? Temps, fuel flow, N1/N2 ratios, etc?

I've heard more than one story of a turbine engine with significant damage and the cockpit indications and performance don't seem significantly affected.

Was this a FADEC engine? An FJ44-3A-24? There is trend data in the FADEC, did they download it and tell you anything about it? I think owners can get the FADEC download kit and get the data themselves.

Or do you have the EEC engine, FJ44-2C? I don't think the -2C has trend data in it but could be wrong about that.

One imagines Williams is going to seek a conference with the ignitor vendor (Champion?) and see what can be done to avoid these situations.


Well, it would have been better if nothing had been wrong in the first place, but I can understand the relief that comes with this.

I've never heard a bad word about Williams service. If I own a Williams engine, I will be on the program. The program is economic leverage, but being off is worse!

Mike C.

But you were smart enough to buy the "insurance". That deserves a pat on the back. Can't find that emoji so how about

Hi John-
I'm glad this little situation worked itself out as the piece that broke off and went through the motor wouldn't be considered "FOD" - as it is not foreign to the engine - it is native. Which means a hull and liability policy in all likelihood would have excluded coverages for this type of situation. It is truly a testimony to the value of these engine programs and I'm glad you posted about it!

I thought turbine airplanes never broke?

Robert

I'm not familiar with engine programs. Is the $146/hour similar to an all-in replacement reserve so that your overhauls and inspections are covered?

Yes.

Pretty much it is thrust as a service. Keep paying Williams, and they will make sure you have thrust.

There are no such programs for pistons, with good reason.

Mike C.

I wondered why you hadn't been flying! Going out on a bike trip with Clements. I'll be in Ouray on Sunday.

Bill U.