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 Post subject: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 14:54 
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Joined: 11/22/12
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Company: Retired
Location: Lynnwood, WA (KPAE)
Aircraft: 1993 Bonanza A36TN
Our Friday meeting featured a presentation on the new Vashon Ranger LSA. Local company, from the Dynon people. They kept it secret until after it was certified and in production, they were flying them at our home field and we didn't notice. Base model is $99,500.

Uses the O-200 instead of a Rotax and is built very rugged for training use and because they're planning to put it on (straight) floats, so it's heavy for an LSA, limiting the useful load. But it has lots of room inside, width and length. Seats fold to make a flat floor to sleep on. Will make an outstanding backcountry camping plane, on wheels or floats. But no taildragger option.

Some innovative ideas to keep costs down. Panels come to the factory pre-painted, with rivet holes drilled and dimpled, so it's any color you want as long as it's white, with several levels of vinyl wrap available of whatever your heart desires.

http://www.vashonaircraft.com/

The official intro will be at Oshkosh but they've already sold the first year's production of 30.


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 16:50 
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Location: Central Ohio
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This would be a VERY interesting airplane if they had a taildragger option. When I saw Berto's AvWeb review that's the first thing I wondered about. I like the motor, like the panel, like the production level construction, just want a taildragger with fat tires.


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 17:37 
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Joined: 07/07/14
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Location: Dumfries, VA (suburb of DC)
Aircraft: RV-10
It’s a neat plane and nice to see something that’s not vaporware. Their engineer, Ken Kruger, was over at Van’s designing RVs for many years.

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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 18:24 
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Joined: 08/13/14
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Aircraft: Cessna T206H
Been watching this for a few weeks now.
Very exciting to see this group of people together designing a simple, robust, and CHEAP airplane.
Bravo!


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 18:41 
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Username Protected wrote:
want a taildragger with fat tires.
CubCrafters can help you out there but it'll cost more. The owner of Vashon likes seaplanes so floats were in the plan from the start (they're designing their own) but he isn't interested in taildraggers so no. And the tires are as big as they could go within the LSA empty weight limit. They're big for an LSA, just not as big as they wanted.


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 18:42 
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No dihedral, no wing wash out, constant chord/section root to tip.

I'd wonder a lot about its behavior at or near stall with no apparent treatments for handling in that regime.

Mike C.

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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 19:15 
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Username Protected wrote:
I'd wonder a lot about its behavior at or near stall
The internet provides! I found several descriptions of the stall behavior as "benign" but only one detailed description:

"With engine power at idle and flaps up, the wing doesn’t stall in a traditional sense. Full back stick results in mild buffeting and a mushy nose bob at 45 knots, then the airplane settles into a gently porpoising descent at about 50 KIAS.
“We don’t have an airframe parachute,” Kruger said. “But the wing acts a lot like one.”
Stalls at half flaps (20 degrees) and full flaps (40 degrees) are much the same, but the nose-bob takes place at 43 and 42 knots, respectively." https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all ... ady-ranger


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 19:17 
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Joined: 09/05/12
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Found a way to deal with the useful load :eek:

Also discusses the stall characteristics.

https://www.avweb.com/videos/How-Vashon ... 745-1.html

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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 22:02 
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Joined: 10/05/11
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Username Protected wrote:
No dihedral, no wing wash out, constant chord/section root to tip.

I'd wonder a lot about its behavior at or near stall with no apparent treatments for handling in that regime.

Mike C.


AvWeb video with Paul B had some stall stuff.

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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 07 May 2018, 22:32 
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Username Protected wrote:
AvWeb video with Paul B had some stall stuff.
Stall starts at about 13:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExL7bDb_zZA


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 08 May 2018, 17:29 
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Username Protected wrote:
Found a way to deal with the useful load :eek:


Can you please explain?
I watched the video but I still don’t understand your reference.


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 08 May 2018, 19:55 
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Username Protected wrote:
Found a way to deal with the useful load :eek:


Can you please explain?
I watched the video but I still don’t understand your reference.



Listen to his comment around the 12:22 to 12:36 mark. Discusses over gross flying.
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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 08 May 2018, 22:04 
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This is not going to fly any better than Cessna 162, especially when a factory-completed RV-12 exists. The only thing that can save the whole enterprise is certification for higher gross weight under the new Part 23.


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 22 May 2018, 11:09 
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Aircraft: 1993 Bonanza A36TN
At Saturday's show I got a good look at the Ranger along with a chat with Ken, the designer. Very impressive, a solid feel to everything. A 6'5" guy came by and found he could sit in it and, with the seats folded, lie down flat. While he was in there, Ken had him scrunch as far back as he could get toward the tail, right against the back wall of the baggage compartment, yet there was still plenty of weight on the nosewheel, no need for a tail stand.

Also, the wrap looks seamless. I'd read that wraps have trouble with rivet heads but there was no sign of that here, it looked perfect over each one.


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 Post subject: Re: Vashon Ranger, new S-LSA
PostPosted: 22 May 2018, 16:24 
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Joined: 11/16/10
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Location: Buffalo MN KCFE
Aircraft: S35 E35 C120
Username Protected wrote:
This is not going to fly any better than Cessna 162, especially when a factory-completed RV-12 exists. The only thing that can save the whole enterprise is certification for higher gross weight under the new Part 23.


One big difference is the high wing, no RV will ever be even a ok float plane. And for flying around low and slow, a low wing is rather undesirable.
I think it will do well. I laughed when in the video he nonchalantly says “just fly it over gross, all the LSA guys do” so true, if you see two people in a LSA, it’s probably over.

Greg


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