BeechTalk - BT - Help Me Think Through This Supercub Thing

Username Protected · **Posted:** 12 Aug 2017, 11:39

I used to have a 90hp J-3 in a partnership. I've thought about going that route again. But either one will be worth more or less the same in 5 years as it is now, and the fixed costs would be about the same. The Supercub would burn marginally more fuel and tie up more capital, but that's about the only financial difference I see.

What's amazing is that a Supercub costs about the same as a comparable 180. It's crazy. Presumably, maintenance on a 180 would be significantly more. And a 180 (or 185) has a lot of mission overlap with the Bo, making it harder to justify keeping both. Here's what owner/enthusiasts say about each:

180 owner: "It's a beast!"

Supercub owner: "It's a hoot!"

Username Protected · **Posted:** 12 Aug 2017, 12:32

They are both WAY overpriced but the market is what it is.

A 180 is a tailwheel 182. (and vice versa). Same engine, same fuselage. That little tailwheel can set you back an additional 20-40k vs a comparable 60s era 182. But, so what. It is what it is. If you want to join the cool guy club, you gotta pony up.
I land at the same places as the cool guys but they won't let me hang out at their campfire. Counseling is helping.

( I do, however, put them up in the guest house when they rip off their tail wheels)

Username Protected · **Posted:** 12 Aug 2017, 14:28

Mike, you're absolutely right. It comes back to the toy thing. People want to play with the toy that has that little wheel in the back. And they're overpriced as a result.

Not only does a Supercub cost at least as much as a 180, but both cost more than many Barons. Weird stuff.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 12 Aug 2017, 15:15

Supply and demand, nothing more.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 12 Aug 2017, 19:30

Mike, I have a hard time considering them "overpriced".

How many Bonanzas are primarily used for legitimate commercial purposes?

Supply, demand because the 180/185 and Super Cubs are actually used for work. :bugeye:

My friend at Skywagons recently sold four 180/185's and a SCub to a buyer in Alaska. He offered me the opportunity to ferry one or more, but this DAMN house is still holding me down.

Most all 180/185's and many 206's are float ready to boot. My 180 is an exception and has the "even rarer" stretcher door.

Most of these airplanes end their days smashed up in far away places so the supply is dwindling.

I don't agree with "overpriced" in any sense. How are they overpriced when a new 206 is $650,000 plus and a Top Cub, over $300,00? I cruised through the Ford lot last Sunday and pretty much every truck there was stickered at over $65,000.

Jgreen

Username Protected · **Posted:** 13 Aug 2017, 17:52

Stuart,

I called Corey today about the availability of a SC. He is not aware of any, but he will sniff it out to see if something lies below the surface.

We will be through with the new Selkirk panels, headliner, and seats in the 180 this week. I'll be planning the panel next, but with all the new "stuff" coming out everyday, I'm afraid to commit just yet. Still waiting on that $5,000 IFR cert GPS. :cross:

Here are some "almost" complete pics of the 180 interior.

Jgreen

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Aug 2017, 11:06

Username Protected wrote:

I have a WTB ad here for a Supercub, which illustrates that I'm serious about buying one. No one has responded to the ad here or its twin that I posted on Supercub.org, which says something about the state of the Supercub market. Not sure what, but something.

Flying Supercubs can be had for as low as $50k. Special ones might fetch $150k or more. Here are my jumbled thoughts, presented in the hope that BT will have some advice on how to solidify my thinking. FWIW, I'm 55 and healthy, 5'10", 185#, and I don't like cats.

There are a couple of ways to think about this:
1) Buy ratty, fly a couple of years, and sell ratty.

2) Buy ratty, fix up, fly until I'm too inflexible to enter a Cub.

3) Buy nice, figure I can sell nice whenever the need arises.

4) Buy nice, make it nicer, win an Oshkosh award!

Max Grogan (RIP) always said you should buy at the top of your desired market. That way, you'll have something worth buying when you need to sell.

#1 is the thing to do if a) I think this bug will wear off or b) I think I might get seriously into taildragging, etc. Then I could sell the Cub and the Bo to buy a 180.

I THINK what I want is to buy something I can keep for 10 years without buying fabric or an engine. Looks like that can be done for somewhat less than 100 if the airplane can be found. What happens, though, is people pull the airplane apart to cover it and start doing "while you're in there" stuff and the next thing you know, they're looking at a Supercub with autopilot, G500, and ADS-B. Yet, interestingly, they don't do the rear spar mod that gives a 250# GW increase.

Stuart,

The best bang for your buck is an '89-'94 supercub. Most were bought in that time frame by people with $$ so they have been hangered and taken care of.

I would not do the 2K gross upgrade unless you move up to 180HP.

Our '89 supercub has a belly pod, borer prop, and 31" bushwheels. We have safety cables on it but I think they are overkill because the tires absorb so much shock. Safety cables have saved several airplanes with rusted out gear though. We have the stock baggage, the pod gives you all of the additional space you need, and the bonus is that it keeps the weight under the CG.

We had some cylinder problems so it now has the 160HP pistons in it.

It has enough in the panel to do light IFR if needed. If you do any amount of traveling an XM subscription is essential to utilize winds aloft to make the best of you 95MPH cruise.

My wife and I have taken ours all over the place from Ohio. Maine, Idaho, Montana, and the Bahamas.

Tim

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Aug 2017, 19:47

Username Protected wrote:

I would not do the 2K gross upgrade unless you move up to 180HP.

Why is that?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Aug 2017, 20:22

Stuart,

I think what is keeping you away from a SC is the cat thing. SC owners and cats have a lot in common; a little different, a little unpredictable, slightly discerning etc.

I'm thinking that SC owners might think you don't belong.

Just a thought. Post an ad, "Want to buy a Super Cub and I love cats".

It's worth a try.

You think? :scratch:

Jgreen

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Aug 2017, 20:30

I'm going to start looking at ads for them .....mostly for entertainment I miss those days of looking for a plane.

Will let you know if I see a screaming deal out here in the west.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Aug 2017, 20:49

Username Protected wrote:

Why is that?

If you have a Cub at 2000 pounds you no longer have a Cub but an overweight fat pig. Get a Cessna 180.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Aug 2017, 21:40

Username Protected wrote:

If you have a Cub at 2000 pounds you no longer have a Cub but an overweight fat pig. Get a Cessna 180.

The only people who aren't trying to talk me into a 180 are the ones trying to sell me a 185. What a strange situation!

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Aug 2017, 01:15

Supercub and v35. Way different missions. Perfect 2 plane combo in the hangar.

185 and v35. Closer mission profile. You'll find yourself not needing one or the other. I'm there with the A36 and 182. The 182 comes close enough on the cross country flights to not need the extra hangar/insurance/maintenance bills of the A36. The 182 simply performs better for my missions in the sticks. It's sad but utility and practicality is pushing the A36 to the auction block. I'll miss the speed

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Aug 2017, 06:14

Let me know if you decide Mike. Friend looking for a 36 from the Big Easy.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Aug 2017, 07:53

A SC and a 180/185 are hardly the same "type" of airplane. Their missions for rough fields can over lap, but that's about it. Once the wheels clear the ground, the 180/185 is pretty much a Skylane.

The Cub in any form is a low and slow, window open to the breeze, "lookin' at stuff close up" kind of airplane. The 180/185 is a load carrying go somewhere kind of airplane.

The Cub is dirt simple to fly and uncomfortable as hell for more than one hour in the seat.

I own a 100 HP Cub and a 180. Their missions don't overlap at all for me. Neither is for sale.

Stuart, you can find a Cub if you want one. Just like any other airplane, its cost is the sum of the value of its parts with fabric and engine condition leading the way. New fabric and an overhauled engine alone are going to cost $75,000. You won't find any cheap ones. "Cheap" is an adjective that has no place in the description of an airplane.

Jgreen