banner
banner

28 Mar 2024, 14:51 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


Concorde Battery (banner)



Reply to topic  [ 40 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Username Protected Message
 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 17 Jun 2017, 14:59 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 03/08/14
Posts: 1155
Post Likes: +541
Location: Cordova,Tn
Aircraft: Comanche 260B
Beautiful 182, Congratulations! :thumbup:

_________________
Mike Duncan
N8931P


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 17 Jun 2017, 22:23 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 03/28/10
Posts: 1106
Post Likes: +268
Location: Columbus, OH
Aircraft: AA5B
Username Protected wrote:
Sounds like there are two issues.

1. Planes being misrepresented in ads. Nothing new there. That's why you get LOTS of photos and the log books in digital form before going to see it.

2. Planes being priced above what the buyer thinks a 182 should sell for.

On that one, I'm reminded that the market is never wrong. As Mike said, it is what it is. If 182s are selling for more than you think they should, it's time to adjust what you think they should sell for.

You can get the plane that sells for the price you want to pay, or you can get the plane that you want.

One note: Asking isn't getting. If I want to spend $50,000 for a plane (just to pick a number), I set up my search for planes listed at $70,000. Adjust the numbers for the price you want to pay.


Really! Are you saying that the asking prices are that much overpriced ($20,000)? That is on the order of 30% for the example you gave. I would believe maybe 80-85% of asking. If true I have been looking at this all wrong.


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 02:23 
Offline



 Profile




Joined: 12/09/07
Posts: 16989
Post Likes: +12387
Location: Cascade, ID (U70)
Aircraft: C182
Username Protected wrote:
Sounds like there are two issues.

1. Planes being misrepresented in ads. Nothing new there. That's why you get LOTS of photos and the log books in digital form before going to see it.

2. Planes being priced above what the buyer thinks a 182 should sell for.

On that one, I'm reminded that the market is never wrong. As Mike said, it is what it is. If 182s are selling for more than you think they should, it's time to adjust what you think they should sell for.

You can get the plane that sells for the price you want to pay, or you can get the plane that you want.

One note: Asking isn't getting. If I want to spend $50,000 for a plane (just to pick a number), I set up my search for planes listed at $70,000. Adjust the numbers for the price you want to pay.


Really! Are you saying that the asking prices are that much overpriced ($20,000)? That is on the order of 30% for the example you gave. I would believe maybe 80-85% of asking. If true I have been looking at this all wrong.


You don't get if you don't ask. :shrug:
_________________
"Great photo! You must have a really good camera."


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 09:02 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 03/28/10
Posts: 1106
Post Likes: +268
Location: Columbus, OH
Aircraft: AA5B
Quote:
Really! Are you saying that the asking prices are that much overpriced ($20,000)? That is on the order of 30% for the example you gave. I would believe maybe 80-85% of asking. If true I have been looking at this all wrong.


You don't get if you don't ask. :shrug:[/quote]

I would agree in general.

Not to hijack the thread, but. I have watched the prices for quite a while now. While Vref is only a guide, it seems like most asking prices are on the order of 25-30% higher than they are based on Vref. For example, 1965 C-182 with nothing better than 1 KX-155, 1200 SMOH 25 years ago, with an asking price of $61K. Looking at Vref, you are in the mid 40's, or around 80%. No wonder these planes sit on the market at least 3-4 months, or longer. Airplanes are not like growth stocks, unless you put money in, and then you only get about 50-60% of the value of the upgrade unless done in the last 2-3 years depending on the upgrade. Long gone are the early 2000 when prices were rising. The bubble burst in 2005-2006.


Last edited on 18 Jun 2017, 10:12, edited 1 time in total.

Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 10:07 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 09/23/09
Posts: 11841
Post Likes: +10440
Location: Cascade, Idaho (U70)
Aircraft: 182
Agreed. One would be thrilled with a 50% ROI for an upgrade in an airplane.

_________________
Life is for living
Backcountry videos: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCSChxm ... fOnWwngH1w


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 12:28 
Offline



User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 07/13/09
Posts: 5043
Post Likes: +6500
Location: Nirvana
Aircraft: OPAs
That said....not all “61 Skylanes” are the same.

The one I bought I paid more than Vref...but I think was a good value at about 60K. Mid time engine, IFR panel, very nice paint/interior.....


But I’ve seen some 182s that were many years later that were dogs. Or pigs with lipstick.

There’s no substitute for knowing what a “good plane” looks like, and being ready to pull the money out of your pocket and buying it when you see a good one. The seller of the one I bought had a buyer the week before I showed up....the buyer got a prebuy done at a shop that I trust. The “buyer” passed on it because the compressions were in the 50s and 60s *cold*.


I showed up a week later, made a cash offer, bought it.

I’ve put over a 100 hrs on it now, uses virtually no oil (a quart every 10 hours) is an honest 135 knots, reliable as a rock.

So, you might find one that Vref/s out at 48K, but by the time you got it “right” you would have spent more than 60K.


stan

_________________
"Most of my money I spent on airplanes. The rest I just wasted....."
---the EFI, POF-----


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 15:05 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 07/07/13
Posts: 1371
Post Likes: +781
Aircraft: V35B Cub
Username Protected wrote:
That said....not all “61 Skylanes” are the same.

The one I bought I paid more than Vref...but I think was a good value at about 60K. Mid time engine, IFR panel, very nice paint/interior.....


But I’ve seen some 182s that were many years later that were dogs. Or pigs with lipstick.

There’s no substitute for knowing what a “good plane” looks like, and being ready to pull the money out of your pocket and buying it when you see a good one. The seller of the one I bought had a buyer the week before I showed up....the buyer got a prebuy done at a shop that I trust. The “buyer” passed on it because the compressions were in the 50s and 60s *cold*.


I showed up a week later, made a cash offer, bought it.

I’ve put over a 100 hrs on it now, uses virtually no oil (a quart every 10 hours) is an honest 135 knots, reliable as a rock.

So, you might find one that Vref/s out at 48K, but by the time you got it “right” you would have spent more than 60K.


stan


Stan's remarks are spot on about ready to pull the trigger with cash on hand. There is a reason these (any) airplanes languish on the market and the good ones sell quickly. I actually had a harder time buying and finding the right 182 then finding my Beech.

I was pretty selective though as to not waste my time. I would not even look at airplanes that had no price listed. And in the end I didn't bother calling planes listed with brokers. Every one had their commission built into the price. Some of those 182's have been listed for months.

You end up getting a feel for the seller and I lucked out with the prior owner. As with Stan I bought it with a handshake and a cash deal. Done.


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 21 Jun 2017, 01:16 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 12/12/14
Posts: 917
Post Likes: +169
Location: Boise, ID
Buying a plane, economically, is a lot more of a science than you may think. There are a lot of drivers in pricing, and resale is not even remotely tied to money invested, nor cost. Let's get down to it: Airframe and Engine time make up 75% of it.

Have you looked at the market for two months prior, noting which planes are listing and selling, and which are not? What price did they sell for?

Have you wasted multiple commercial airline tickets on airplanes to pass on them?

Have you spent a good 4-6 months shopping?

Have you submitted multiple low-ball offers to feel the market (Sorry, any BTers I might have offended)?

Did you jump on any planes ready to pay cash the next day and find out someone bought it before you?

Now you really have a good idea of the market. This isn't a car, you can't search ebay completed items and see what things are worth, even for a 182.

Now it's time to identify the features you must have in your plane. Separate out the "must haves" on purchase from nice to haves. (hint: those which cost a lot to add and change minimal resale should be bought in the plane).

Sure, you can buy a plane without this, just like you can walk in a car lot and buy from the dealer. It's easier, less hassle, but is not the private party market clearing price.

Then, when the plane comes, make an offer at the right price and purchase. It's always better to buy at the right price than sell at the wrong. You will also save money per hour in the long run spending a little more now.


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 21 Jun 2017, 05:38 
Offline



User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 08/30/10
Posts: 4120
Post Likes: +2110
Location: Kingston, NY (20N)
Aircraft: 1985 Bonanza F33A
I sold my 1976 182P model with a new engine, 20yr old paint and interior, good avionics for 123k with an asking price of 129k a few years ago. 182 market is strong for good examples. Mine was on the market less than 2 weeks and was the highest priced 182 P or Q models.

I paid 100k, flew it 800hrs, had a maintenance induced engine failure at 900hrs and put a 30k factory engine and prop IRAN in it.


Top

 Post subject: Re: New to me 182
PostPosted: 21 Jun 2017, 23:55 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 12/12/14
Posts: 917
Post Likes: +169
Location: Boise, ID
Username Protected wrote:
I sold my 1976 182P model with a new engine, 20yr old paint and interior, good avionics for 123k with an asking price of 129k a few years ago. 182 market is strong for good examples. Mine was on the market less than 2 weeks and was the highest priced 182 P or Q models.

I paid 100k, flew it 800hrs, had a maintenance induced engine failure at 900hrs and put a 30k factory engine and prop IRAN in it.


How did your mechanic kill it so I don't repeat your experience?


Top

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic  [ 40 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3




You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  

Terms of Service | Forum FAQ | Contact Us

BeechTalk, LLC is the quintessential Beechcraft Owners & Pilots Group providing a forum for the discussion of technical, practical, and entertaining issues relating to all Beech aircraft. These include the Bonanza (both V-tail and straight-tail models), Baron, Debonair, Duke, Twin Bonanza, King Air, Sierra, Skipper, Sport, Sundowner, Musketeer, Travel Air, Starship, Queen Air, BeechJet, and Premier lines of airplanes, turboprops, and turbojets.

BeechTalk, LLC is not affiliated or endorsed by the Beechcraft Corporation, its subsidiaries, or affiliates. Beechcraft™, King Air™, and Travel Air™ are the registered trademarks of the Beechcraft Corporation.

Copyright© BeechTalk, LLC 2007-2024

.ABS-85x100.jpg.
.aviationdesigndouble.jpg.
.bpt-85x50-2019-07-27.jpg.
.wat-85x50.jpg.
.aircraftferry-85x50.jpg.
.airmart-85x150.png.
.kingairnation-85x50.png.
.pdi-85x50.jpg.
.lucysaviation-85x50.png.
.CiESVer2.jpg.
.geebee-85x50.jpg.
.sierratrax-85x50.png.
.Wentworth_85x100.JPG.
.blackwell-85x50.png.
.jetacq-85x50.jpg.
.kingairacademy-85x100.png.
.headsetsetc_Small_85x50.jpg.
.midwest2.jpg.
.aircraftassociates-85x50.png.
.ei-85x150.jpg.
.SCA.jpg.
.tat-85x100.png.
.pure-medical-85x150.png.
.avfab-85x50-2018-12-04.png.
.MountainAirframe.jpg.
.aeroled-85x50-2022-12-06.jpg.
.centex-85x50.jpg.
.bullardaviation-85x50-2.jpg.
.stanmusikame-85x50.jpg.
.Foreflight_85x50_color.png.
.planelogix-85x100-2015-04-15.jpg.
.jandsaviation-85x50.jpg.
.saint-85x50.jpg.
.blackhawk-85x100-2019-09-25.jpg.
.concorde.jpg.
.one-mile-up-85x100.png.
.tempest.jpg.
.Rocky-Mountain-Turbine-85x100.jpg.
.temple-85x100-2015-02-23.jpg.
.ssv-85x50-2023-12-17.jpg.
.Genesys_85x50.jpg.
.camguard.jpg.
.kadex-85x50.jpg.
.wilco-85x100.png.
.dbm.jpg.
.Latitude.jpg.
.avionwealth-85x50.png.
.traceaviation-85x150.png.
.Marsh.jpg.
.boomerang-85x50-2023-12-17.png.
.shortnnumbers-85x100.png.
.chairmanaviation-85x50.jpg.
.cav-85x50.jpg.
.AAI.jpg.
.daytona.jpg.
.gallagher_85x50.jpg.
.Wingman 85x50.png.