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 Post subject: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 13:01 
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Joined: 02/21/13
Posts: 19
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Location: WA
Aircraft: In between planes...
Hello...

A buddy is shopping Sixes. He's a brand new student pilot, and I'm going to try to help him along as much as I can.

Questions I don't know the answers to about Sixes are:

1. Do they have factory zinc chromate, or any other type of factory corrosion proofing?
2. 14v or 28v electrical systems (and if it changed from 14 to 28, what year)?
3. I know some have 4 tanks and some have 2. I've heard 2 is the more desirable setup. What year was this change made?
4. Was factory air conditioning available on the 6/260? I haven't seen any for sale, but we are leaning towards a 260 for budget reasons and speed isn't really a factor because the mission is short hops with big loads. AC would be really nice.
5. From a ballpark standpoint is it best to look at the newest models before it became the Saratoga?

Thanks! :pilot:

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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 13:19 
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Joined: 06/20/12
Posts: 273
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Location: Oklahoma
Aircraft: C-90, Evolution
Username Protected wrote:
Hello...

A buddy is shopping Sixes. He's a brand new student pilot, and I'm going to try to help him along as much as I can.

Questions I don't know the answers to about Sixes are:

1. Do they have factory zinc chromate, or any other type of factory corrosion proofing?
2. 14v or 28v electrical systems (and if it changed from 14 to 28, what year)?
3. I know some have 4 tanks and some have 2. I've heard 2 is the more desirable setup. What year was this change made?
4. Was factory air conditioning available on the 6/260? I haven't seen any for sale, but we are leaning towards a 260 for budget reasons and speed isn't really a factor because the mission is short hops with big loads. AC would be really nice.
5. From a ballpark standpoint is it best to look at the newest models before it became the Saratoga?

Thanks! :pilot:



My first plane was a Cherokee 6 260 with ray jay turbo (turbo normalized)

None had air that I knew of. .

Great plane UL was higher than empty weight. I loved the plane. Very easy to fly

I would highly recommend the 300 over the 260

Mike


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 13:59 
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Joined: 05/04/11
Posts: 451
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Location: Covington, GA
Aircraft: 421C, 58
Most do not have zinc chromate. They all have 4 tanks. The 260 and the early 300's have a wing and a tip tank, so the fuel selector has 5 positions. The later models, I think around 1976, have 2 interconnected wing tanks and a three 3 position fuel selector. The later system is more desirable imo. 14 volt until you get to the 1990's models.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 14:08 
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Joined: 01/14/12
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Location: Hampton, VA
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Be aware that the Cherokee Six has a limit to how much weight it can carry that isn't fuel.

I believe the Saratoga models don't.

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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 16:40 
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Joined: 03/25/11
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3. In 1979 the Six got the Lance wing and two tanks with a sight glass where the inboard fill was. I think this is the only year as the next year had the tapered wing and was called a Saratoga.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 22:12 
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Joined: 11/03/08
Posts: 14527
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Location: Peachtree City GA / Stoke-On-Trent UK
Aircraft: A33
Fuel management in the 4 tank models is critical. Fill the tips first. Use every drop from the mains (inboard) before using any from the tips. Easy to spot the owners who don't follow this rule, the tops of their wings are covered with diamond patches.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 22:19 
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Joined: 02/21/13
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Location: WA
Aircraft: In between planes...
Thanks for the responses!

If most of them aren't zinc chromated, is it the newer ones that are?

I know older airframes can be perfectly fine in terms of corrosion, but at least having an additional line of defense would be nice.

Not a single one listed on Trade a Plane now has AC that I can find, 260 or 300! I hope it isn't that rare of an item...

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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 18 Jun 2017, 22:27 
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Location: Peachtree City GA / Stoke-On-Trent UK
Aircraft: A33
Climb is already pretty anemic, I'd hate to think what it would be like with AC hanging in the wind


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 07:00 
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Joined: 01/29/09
Posts: 4693
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Company: retired corporate mostly
Location: Chico,California KCIC/CL56
Aircraft: 1956 Champion 7EC
It is a great load hauler, and if the nose strut is extended you have to taxi like a taildragger... :D (S turns that is).

I flew one with the 3 seat middle row, does that make it a Cherokee 7.... :hide:


Jeff

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soloed in a land of Superhomers/1959 Cessna 150, retired with Proline 21/ CJ4.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 13:40 
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Joined: 11/03/08
Posts: 14527
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Location: Peachtree City GA / Stoke-On-Trent UK
Aircraft: A33
when we had a pa32 our kids were young and innocent, i would never have considered putting them in the front baggage to ride

now that they are teenagers, it makes me stop and think about it, would they still fit up there if we got another lead sled ?


Please login or Register for a free account via the link in the red bar above to download files.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 14:06 
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Joined: 11/20/16
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Location: Austin, TX area
Aircraft: OPA
In '77 I worked for a mechanical contractor that bought a new '76 model, 300hp with A/C. Flew it all over the SW, ran great, easy to fly but handles like a truck. No idea how those 40+ yr old A/C systems are holding up though. We had it into Alamosa and Silver City, NM in Summer. No problems with 5 + bags out of Santa Fe in winter. Very trouble-free airplane.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 14:43 
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Company: airlines (*CRJ,A320)
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Username Protected wrote:
when we had a pa32 our kids were young and innocent, i would never have considered putting them in the front baggage to ride

Ya gotta put one of 'em in there and at least close the door. Otherwise they'll just think it's an empty threat...


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 16:15 
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Joined: 10/31/16
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Username Protected wrote:
Hello...


Hello back.

Quote:
A buddy is shopping Sixes. He's a brand new student pilot, and I'm going to try to help him along as much as I can.


Tell him to get his IFR before buying, his insurance (even in a 6) will be much (much) lower. It's not really that much longer, plus he can get his High Performance and Complex signoffs done to give himself more flight/education time.

Quote:
Questions I don't know the answers to about Sixes are:

1. Do they have factory zinc chromate, or any other type of factory corrosion proofing?


The majority I have seen do not.

Quote:
2. 14v or 28v electrical systems (and if it changed from 14 to 28, what year)?


Some are 14, some are 28, although I don't have the year it changed. Some people changed them later anyway, just like some changed from fuses to breakers. Really, it's not a make or break thing.

Quote:
3. I know some have 4 tanks and some have 2. I've heard 2 is the more desirable setup. What year was this change made?


Most are going to be 4 tanks, but it isn't that bad as long you fly it nicely watching the numbers. The couple guys I knew with one installed an engine monitor with fuel flow to keep track visually as well as time tracking. If this is something he considers too much annoyance to start with a good 205/206/207 high wing might work.

Quote:
4. Was factory air conditioning available on the 6/260? I haven't seen any for sale, but we are leaning towards a 260 for budget reasons and speed isn't really a factor because the mission is short hops with big loads. AC would be really nice.


Even if it doesn't you can add it. Truth be told, unless his is from where it regularly is oven temps, I'd skip it for UL.

Quote:
5. From a ballpark standpoint is it best to look at the newest models before it became the Saratoga?


This is a personal preference. The older models (pre-1973 in particular) will probably have the highest UL. Personally I would get a 1970-1972 6-300, and put in the engine monitor if it doesn't have one. Don't forget to factor in the GAMI's too if needed to run LOP. This is a big six cylinder engine and it can eat gas quickly if you don't lean it out. That being said, it's a big six cylinder engine that isn't cheap to fix if you trash it trying to run LOP without the proper equipment. Add in a good engine management course considering he's new.

Quote:
Thanks! :pilot:


No problem. Here's a couple random other points. Some were suggested to me by other Six owners, some are personal experience.

This bird is typically nose heavy taxing, and not much fun in grass when heavy nosed.

Take off the wheel pants for 100hrs. The Hershey bar wing Cherokees take a bit of getting used to compared to brand C trainers. Doubly true at landing time.

Make sure the person doing the prebuy evaluation knows Cherokee 6's, and knows how to check if that heavy nose was slapped down hard during landing. Many will miss crinkled firewalls.

Do spend a good amount of time with a longer time 6 pilot if possible. These things might fly like over-sized trucks with wings, but that doesn't mean someone can't benefit from a good 20 hours (in varying conditions) flying with someone who knows how the trucks should handle. In fact, if you can have them around longer (30-50 hours) even better, especially if it's "free" and you can shoot approaches and so on. Doubly true if it's your first plane post-brand-C flight training.

No matter what: 6, Lance, or Saratoga, always calculate your CG & Performance. These birds can lull you into a false sense of security because they are capable of carrying a heavy load. All it takes is a DA change and suddenly you aren't climbing like you should, then it's interesting times if you're lucky or an "accident" if you aren't lucky.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 16:45 
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Joined: 11/08/12
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Location: Jackson, MS (KHKS)
Aircraft: 1961 Cessna 172
Username Protected wrote:
Thanks for the responses!

If most of them aren't zinc chromated, is it the newer ones that are?

I know older airframes can be perfectly fine in terms of corrosion, but at least having an additional line of defense would be nice.

Not a single one listed on Trade a Plane now has AC that I can find, 260 or 300! I hope it isn't that rare of an item...



Yes, it is very rare. Still functional even rarer

Zinc chromate nice to have but about 64th priority and it will take a lot of looking to find one that even gets you 10 priorities.


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 Post subject: Re: Cherokee Six questions...
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2017, 17:26 
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Joined: 01/10/13
Posts: 1121
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Location: greenville,ms
Aircraft: baron 58
friend of mine has his for sale but not actively trying to sell it, think it has air but not sure


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