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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 16 Jan 2019, 00:37 
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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 16 Jan 2019, 12:25 
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Username Protected wrote:
The usual restriction about flight over congested areas applies.

What is the restriction, and do they define "congested"? I've heard of legal interpretations where the equivalent of a house and a barn count as 'congested'.

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 16 Jan 2019, 13:46 
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John,

Funny you should ask. That exact question was covered in recurrent. And the answer is ambiguous. So nobody tries too hard to resolve that. The conventional wisdom seems to support the belief that living in the ambiguity is better than getting it resolved.

That said, I may transit over the congested areas for the purpose of getting too/from a take-off/landing.

Thus far it has not impeded daily operations for us.

Zeke


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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 16 Jan 2019, 13:48 
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Username Protected wrote:
What is the restriction, and do they define "congested"? I've heard of legal interpretations where the equivalent of a house and a barn count as 'congested'.


I was thinking anything yellow on a sectional chart, but maybe that's not exactly right?


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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 16 Jan 2019, 13:50 
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Hi Christopher -

The yellow area on the sectional is a good starting point. And interpretations continue from there.

Z


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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 16 Jan 2019, 23:42 
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I enjoyed reading all the earlier posts here. About 20 years ago there was a place in north Alabama that delt in L39’s. Not knowing any better my buddy and I piled in the 172 and flew over and talked with the guy a while. He was a really nice guy and let me down easy ( I only had 125 hours or so :D ) but hey, a guy can dream !

Congrats Zeke ! Keep us updated on your experiences.

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2019, 11:10 
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It would seem that the congested-area limitation would be severely limiting when flying IFR somewhere. Trying to examine both ends of the spectrum, obviously buzzing low-level over a congested area might be an unnecessary risk, but is flying at FL190 on an IFR flight plan that traverses a congested area really a risk? Semantics, I guess. Seems like something that should be resolved by the Feds.

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2019, 12:38 
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Username Protected wrote:
It would seem that the congested-area limitation would be severely limiting when flying IFR somewhere. [...] Seems like something that should be resolved by the Feds.


Be careful what you ask for... you may not like the answer.

The general consensus in the experimental community seems to be that some level of ambiguity is actually a good thing when it comes to regulations like this. Operationally, the "no congested area" restriction isn't an issue at all.

Robert


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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 20 Jan 2019, 18:49 
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I operated 'experimental aircraft' for defensive contractors quite a bit over some congested areas (e.g. Jacksonville FL and Norfolk VA) and it was never an issue other than trying to minimize our flight paths and not 'hanging out' any longer than necessary for the job at hand. However the Feds are running it right now seems to work for the operators. Sounds like a non-problem. Are private operators being treated differently I wonder?


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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2022, 13:50 
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Username Protected wrote:
Well - I just stumbled across this thread searching for something else and I thought I would provide an update.

In the immortal words of Brittany Spears... Oops, I did it again...



Zeke-

I found this thread. still flying your L39? Who else on BT has one?

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2022, 15:08 
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Hi Gary,

Yup. Still flying it. It has now been 4 1/2 years and it has gone well. Getting comfortable in the plane happened pretty quickly. I had no prior turbine time - but it’s a really simple airplane to fly.


There are a couple of predictable places where people get into trouble. Low level acro. You pick up a ton of speed on the back side of a loop. If you’re not well-versed in that environment, then you’re setting yourself of up for failure. Operating ours, we do nothing with a down line below 10,000. Really simple. Rolls - no big deal. Loops, Cubans, etc… must be completed no lower than 10,000.

Next is getting behind the power curve. If you get behind the power curve on final, you can get into trouble and pancake it into the ground. It’s a pretty easy scenario to avoid. Fly final with full flaps, boards out, and you need 95% power to hold glideslope and be on speed. If you retract the boards and select flaps-approach, you have enough to thrust to hold altitude without slowing down. And you will obviously bump the power up. While it is spooling up, you won’t get in trouble.

Finally, lack of proficiency with the emergency procedures. You really need to know them. Especially power loss/reduction down low.

I guess one more area is difficult. It’s a lot to fly it IMC in a busy terminal area. A good autopilot is a must in my opinion.

We upgraded ours with a very spiffy panel (fulll garmin glass, a/p, navigators, etc) and the American 731 engine. Plus lots of other nice-to-haves. American O2 bottles, regulator, and similar system upgrades. It’s very light and performs very well. 400 KTAS at FL280 if you don’t mind burning gas.

My enthusiasm for flying it has decreased as the cost of fuel has gone up. Our local supplier is now $9/gal for Jet A. That will slow you down. We plan on 140 GPH so the pain is real. My partner just took it west for the next 3-4 months so it’s not an issue right now.

Plus, I fell in love with another “fun” plane we recently got so for the past 24 months I’ve been putting a chunk of time in that.

Let me know if I can answer any more questions.

Zeke


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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2022, 15:23 
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All good info. I have one in pre-buy right now...

found one with an engine that has only 200hrs on it. if I keep the plane I'll eventually convert the engine.

thanks for the info- keep it coming...

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2022, 15:24 
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Username Protected wrote:
If you get behind the power curve on final, you can get into trouble and pancake it into the ground. It’s a pretty easy scenario to avoid. Fly final with full flaps, boards out, and you need 95% power to hold glideslope and be on speed. If you retract the boards and select flaps-approach, you have enough to thrust to hold altitude without slowing down. And you will obviously bump the power up. While it is spooling up, you won’t get in trouble.
[...]
We upgraded ours with a very spiffy panel (fulll garmin glass, a/p, navigators, etc) and the American 731 engine. Plus lots of other nice-to-haves. American O2 bottles, regulator, and similar system upgrades. It’s very light and performs very well. 400 KTAS at FL280 if you don’t mind burning gas.


Two questions:
How does it handle a tight curving approach, like the left downwind visual to 17R at KHND? Class B is just 8,000' off the end of the runway.

How hard is it to execute the upgrades from the paperwork side? Does the experimental certificate give you wider latitude on what you can install in the plane?

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2022, 15:27 
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Experimental. Guys are doing all kinds of crap to them.

which is one of the things to watch out for in the used market... (ie., car batteries being wired in series in lieu of a 24v acft battery, etc...)

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 Post subject: Re: L-39 Operators?
PostPosted: 23 Dec 2022, 15:48 
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Jim,

Tight curving approaches are my favorite. Come into the break at 200 or 250 (your pick), at mid-field power to idle, roll into 60 bank, boards out, roll out on downwind at 180, you’ll bleed a little speed then flaps-approach, then set about 90% power. Just past abeam the numbers, let the nose come down, flaps full, and continuous turn to short final. Roll out on final on speed while intercepting standard approach path.

The SFO (simulated flame out) calls for crossing your intended touchdown point at 3000 AGL and 140 KIAS. Roll into a 45 degree bank turn and you‘ll be at 2000 abeam your touchdown point. Gear down and keep the turn coming to final. Select flaps-landing when field is made. Those steep turns at 140 really get you comfortable with the aircraft’s handling in that scenario.

During normal VFR approach (described in first paragraph) I don’t get that steep a roll angle but 29-30 degrees is very comfortable after lots of SFOs at 45 degrees.

Zeke


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