A friend is looking at Piper Navajo Chieftain with Panther conversion. His mission is a weekly trip 475km each way with 1,100# useful load after fueling for the trip. A/C and Cabin Class are a must. His budget is $400k to $600k. Looked at Cessna 421C, but payload is primary problem with it, plus all negative comments about its geared engines.

Is there another plane he should consider?

Turbine planes are out for now, maybe in coup!e years he will see the benefits of King Air.

Don't know his pilot qualifications but with that budget and that mission I'd find a way to make a King Air or MU2 work. I regularly sit right seat in a Panther Navajo and unless you like sucking on oxygen its cruises right in the turbulence/build ups. It's slow and burns a lot of fuel.... Probably a good deal at <$250K but for your friends budget I'd get a turbine even if it meant hiring an instructor/pilot....

Peace,
Don

We have a reasonably nice one under your budget. I will get you price and specs.

You have to fly a king air a lot to make it cost effective. And a 400k King air is not fast either.

Geared engines aren't an issue (any more than any other piston engine). They are some of the best engines Continental ever made.

My 1979 421C, with VGs, has 1156 of useful load with full mains - Enough for 800nm or so of travel.

I like the Navajo line in general, but the lack of pressurization (please correct me if I'm wrong about the Chieftan not having pressurization) would be a non starter for me

That all being said, for a "weekly" trip, I would be looking at a King Air. That's a LOT of flying and it's going to be tough to get scheduled maintenance done.

Robert

475 kilometers (256 nautical miles) or 475 nautical miles?

In the piston world, given that budget, I'd look hard at the 421C for that mission (either one, really). Geared engines are no issue if owner-flown by an owner who cares, IMO. Weekly travel, assuming little tolerance for downtime, says turbine to me though... Any piston will spend some downtime in the shop, generally more than the turbines.

A Duke can do that trip 40 gallons less than full fuel. 202 gallons
2 hr 20 min flight equal 105 gallons leaving 55 gallon reserve.

He is a rider. Sits in the back. Main issue is 1100# useful load after fuel. He plans on 4 plus pilot and baggage. Is there turbine at this price point?

Thanks that would be great. Send me PM with information.

475 kilometers (256 nautical miles) or 475 nautical miles?

In the piston world, given that budget, I'd look hard at the 421C for that mission (either one, really). Geared engines are no issue if owner-flown by an owner who cares, IMO. Weekly travel, assuming little tolerance for downtime, says turbine to me though... Any piston will spend some downtime in the shop, generally more than the turbines.

I had the Chieftain for awhile and it would fit this mission fine.

It's a 2.6 hour trip.

The panther conversion for the Chieftain doesn't add a lot, I'd argue for a regular Chieftain.

It's very reliable, has a good airframe, great engines and proven... way better than the Cessna cabin twins.

But a 421 would be a contender with pressure... but not huge.

Both come with AC, turbo's nice quiet cabins and either could do the job. The Chieftain will operate cheaper per mile and probably more reliable... but not huge. Time for the trip would be within a few minutes of each other.

The 421 is a bit more comfy... but not significant. The Chieftain is more reliable... just has fewer parts.

If a budget is the issue, the Chieftain is hard to beat. If not, a KingAir may be a better choice.

If mountains are a factor, I'd skip the Chieftain and get pressure.

The Chieftain we bought was operated by a fortune 300 company and did weekly or more runs between Chicago and St. Louis... 475nm. and served them well. Their jet didn't save much time.

I agree, King Air would be great, and is the answer long term. At purchase price of $450k and estimated 250 to 300 hours per year, I don't know that it makes sense, cost wise.

He is a rider. Sits in the back. Main issue is 1100# useful load after fuel. He plans on 4 plus pilot and baggage. Is there turbine at this price point?

With your guy liking the Navajo/Chieftan airframe, a 250+ knot, 1200 lb. full fuel payload Cheyenne II would do the trick. I have done that length trip a lot in the Cheyenne and Baron. Month in and month out, in most all weather, the flight level capability makes a difference. If doing it every week, it would make a big difference.

Jimmy,
Where is the plane going to be based out of? Also have your friend talk to some owner/operators who own and fly a 421 to get the real scoop. We flew our plane >350 hours last year without a single AOG. Have your friend text or call me 904-465-2445.

Tony