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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 00:36 
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We should do a drawing on guessing what TAS he gets out of her.

If he is lucky, it never get airborne and he doesn't die test flying it.

Mike C.

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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 01:07 
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Pretty sure the plane will not live up to it’s claims. But I think the guy is pretty conservative in his testing process and seems patient. So I think he will get it flying. He will be very discouraged with the performance but hopefully he keeps pushing and gets the best out of the design.

It has potential and eventually it could be a really great aircraft. Just won’t happen as fast as he expects. At this stage in the project it’s when you start to lower your expectations.

On paper it’s a cool project.

I think he will get at least 220 true in the flight levels out of it eventually. Which would still be a great performer. I would expect it to beat the PA-46 in performance.

I am rooting for the guy.

Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 01:44 
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I feel like the big problem is going to be that he’s gone through all his money and any major hiccup will shut the entire project down.

Either way, I think his whole angle is to get it flying so he can get some investors to take it over. If we pretend that this project is a huge success. It’s not going to be a $130k when other people get involved.


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 01:50 
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Pretty sure the plane will not live up to it’s claims.

That was known from the start by basic sanity checking.

Quote:
On paper it’s a cool project.

For safety reasons, it should have stayed on paper.

Seriously, the test pilot on this project is in real danger. I give 50/50 odds someone dies before they get to 10 hours flight time on the plane.

Mike C.

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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 06:43 
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Reminds me of a Bede wanna be...

FIFY

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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 07:05 
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Seriously, the test pilot on this project is in real danger. I give 50/50 odds someone dies before they get to 10 hours flight time on the plane.

Mike C.


He got a new test pilot? I thought the one he had lined up bailed after looking over the plane.


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 08:16 
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77 pages, so far on HBA, https://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/foru ... 21/page-77

He’s got some weird rubber coupling between the engine and redrive that has already failed once just in the testing.
Maybe he could borrow one of Mike’s -10s.


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 10:22 
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Username Protected wrote:
Seriously, the test pilot on this project is in real danger. I give 50/50 odds someone dies before they get to 10 hours flight time on the plane.

Mike C.


He got a new test pilot? I thought the one he had lined up bailed after looking over the plane.


Yeah, he found another test pilot. The guy is suppose to come at the end of the month to check it out.

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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 10:29 
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I bet that one will come to the same conclusion after inspecting the aircraft.


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 10:41 
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6dDsyWzbg-o


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 11:08 
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Username Protected wrote:
He’s got some weird rubber coupling between the engine and redrive that has already failed once just in the testing.

That's a pretty good choice for the torque pulses that a diesel will send through a propeller driveshaft, and pushers with the engine buried in the fuselage have to have a driveshaft. The VK-30 had to solve similar problems and I think it also used elastomeric couplings (and a big bore Continental... speaking of torque pulses). The problem is that the driveshaft can resonate; the rubber makes a good damper. It also worked alright to connect the (gasoline/Otto) engines in Alfa Romeos with the rear transaxle (I can't remember how the driveshaft on Corvettes is connected at each end). Some helicopter rotor blades use elastomeric bearings to connect them to the rotor hub... think about that next time you see an H-60 fly over.

Like anything else, you have to engineer the part for the job, test it, and then make adjustments to the design as required.


:peace:


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 11:34 
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Username Protected wrote:
He’s got some weird rubber coupling between the engine and redrive that has already failed once just in the testing.

That's a pretty good choice for the torque pulses that a diesel will send through a propeller driveshaft, and pushers with the engine buried in the fuselage have to have a driveshaft. The VK-30 had to solve similar problems and I think it also used elastomeric couplings (and a big bore Continental... speaking of torque pulses). The problem is that the driveshaft can resonate; the rubber makes a good damper. It also worked alright to connect the (gasoline/Otto) engines in Alfa Romeos with the rear transaxle (I can't remember how the driveshaft on Corvettes is connected at each end). Some helicopter rotor blades use elastomeric bearings to connect them to the rotor hub... think about that next time you see an H-60 fly over.

Like anything else, you have to engineer the part for the job, test it, and then make adjustments to the design as required.


:peace:



...yes, but the failure mode looked to be a complete de-coupling. Turning the prop into a freewheeling speed brake.

I think I'd want something that still had input/output interference if the dampening component failed.
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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 11:42 
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Man, talk about aft CG, that thing only has only 340# on the front. And those high EGTs. This would have been a cool project if he wasn’t so adamant about using the TDI. Or at least hired an engine expert they could at least size some turbos for it.


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 11:46 
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The entire power plant should have been doing flight testing on another airframe for the past few years. Some very experienced aviation companies have worked with converting diesel engines for aircraft, most have been failures by economic and usability measures. Diamond has probably done the best, it was not without a steep learning curve.

All eggs in one basket, every egg is unproven.

Kevin


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 Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2019, 11:56 
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The entire power plant should have been doing flight testing on another airframe for the past few years. Some very experienced aviation companies have worked with converting diesel engines for aircraft, most have been failures by economic and usability measures. Diamond has probably done the best, it was not without a steep learning curve.

All eggs in one basket, every egg is unproven.

Kevin


I mean he did just use a website to pick the turbos and never even got the setup on the dyno. :coffee:

They needed a team that did nothing but the engine if they planned on using a non-proven engine.


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