25 Apr 2024, 02:28 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Username Protected
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 15 Aug 2021, 14:51 |
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Joined: 01/18/11 Posts: 7690 Post Likes: +3687 Location: Lakeland , Ga
Aircraft: H35, T-41B, Aircoupe
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Username Protected wrote: I wonder if the ducted fans have similar polars to the first airframe. The new one is bipolar
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Username Protected
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 15 Aug 2021, 17:30 |
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Joined: 08/24/13 Posts: 8463 Post Likes: +3713 Company: Aviation Tools / CCX Location: KSMQ New Jersey
Aircraft: TBM700C2
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Username Protected wrote: I'll raise you by one ramjet
Wait a minute! Just to be clear, Monsieur Leduc was an absolutely brilliant engineer whose work helped push knowledge for both the French and the US air force. Definitely in a class of his own.
Agreed! just had to make the reference. I saw the Leduc in person at the wonderful museum at Le Bourget.
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Username Protected
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 16 Aug 2021, 19:43 |
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Joined: 12/10/07 Posts: 30761 Post Likes: +10757 Location: Minneapolis, MN (KFCM)
Aircraft: 1970 Baron B55
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Username Protected wrote: On an aircraft that needs something like 70% of the max HP all the time there is just not much savings to be had with a smaller motor and a battery for the high HP peaks. Add to that the losses that come from converting motion to electricity then back to motion, you are going to need as big an engine as you would need to simply drive the prop directly. You get a bunch of additional weight and complexity for no benefit.
The original Raptor claims were a farce on the face of it. Raptor NG is even worse. But it sounds so futuristic!On a positive not this eliminates Peter's poorly designed redrive. But I almost hate to see what kind of kludge he comes up for controlling the engine, motors, generators, and battery. For most folks, designing that would be at least 10 time more complex than a redrive.
_________________ -lance
It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.
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Username Protected
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 16 Aug 2021, 21:24 |
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Joined: 03/17/08 Posts: 6072 Post Likes: +12504 Location: KMCW
Aircraft: B55 PII,F-1,L-2,OTW,
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Username Protected wrote: I thought the Raptor would never fly. I was wrong, strictly speaking. The NG will never fly.This time, I won't be wrong. Building something that will fly is relatively easy. Building something that is better than the existing models is incredibly difficult. All it takes to build something that flies is time and money. But to beat an RV or a Bonanza, that is a feat.
_________________ Tailwinds, Doug Rozendaal MCW Be Nice, Kind, I don't care, be something, just don't be a jerk ;-)
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Username Protected
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 16 Aug 2021, 21:44 |
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Joined: 10/07/18 Posts: 2693 Post Likes: +1802 Location: Columbus, Ohio
Aircraft: Baron 58, Lear 35
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Username Protected wrote: On a positive not this eliminates Peter's poorly designed redrive. But I almost hate to see what kind of kludge he comes up for controlling the engine, motors, generators, and battery. For most folks, designing that would be at least 10 time more complex than a redrive.
If this aeronautical abomination makes it to “power on” stage, I clearly see Peter being able to add “experienced arc welder” to his resume’.
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 17 Aug 2021, 00:41 |
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Joined: 01/10/16 Posts: 1119 Post Likes: +1269 Location: KLBO
Aircraft: Cessna 172
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Username Protected wrote: Let's get serious, this hybrid ducted fan thing is a pure boondoggle. Outfits with serious backing, like the UK and German governments, are working on it and have multi-million dollar budgets. None are flying.
On a more basic level, hybrid really doesn't make sense. Hybrid only works when the HP demand is fairly low most of the time and high HP is only needed occasionally and for short durations, like a car.
On an aircraft that needs something like 70% of the max HP all the time there is just not much savings to be had with a smaller motor and a battery for the high HP peaks. Add to that the losses that come from converting motion to electricity then back to motion, you are going to need as big an engine as you would need to simply drive the prop directly. You get a bunch of additional weight and complexity for no benefit.
The original Raptor claims were a farce on the face of it. Raptor NG is even worse. Maybe he is planning on using RATO for takeoff and climb???
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 17 Aug 2021, 07:53 |
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Joined: 04/26/13 Posts: 19965 Post Likes: +19716 Location: Columbus , IN (KBAK)
Aircraft: 1968 Baron D55
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Username Protected wrote: Let's get serious, this hybrid ducted fan thing is a pure boondoggle. Outfits with serious backing, like the UK and German governments, are working on it and have multi-million dollar budgets. None are flying.
On a more basic level, hybrid really doesn't make sense. Hybrid only works when the HP demand is fairly low most of the time and high HP is only needed occasionally and for short durations, like a car. The inability of government backed entities succeeding is not a reliable indicator. You could toss Boeing in as an example (choose aircraft, or spacecraft, the result is similar). He doesn't need the HP in cruise, only for takeoff. My guess is that he's thinking of it like a Chevy Volt, where it uses the battery to get up and cruise, and then recharges the battery and runs ancillary systems off of the generator. That's not to say that any of it will work, but I can kind of see his line of thought.
_________________ My last name rhymes with 'geese'.
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 17 Aug 2021, 09:06 |
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Joined: 05/01/14 Posts: 8804 Post Likes: +13591 Location: Операционный офис КГБ
Aircraft: TU-104
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Username Protected wrote: where it uses the battery to get up and cruise, So for most of the flight except for the power off glide to a cornfield?
_________________ Be kinder than I am. It’s a low bar. Flight suits = superior knowledge
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 17 Aug 2021, 09:11 |
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Joined: 12/10/07 Posts: 30761 Post Likes: +10757 Location: Minneapolis, MN (KFCM)
Aircraft: 1970 Baron B55
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Username Protected wrote: He doesn't need the HP in cruise, only for takeoff. My guess is that he's thinking of it like a Chevy Volt, where it uses the battery to get up and cruise, and then recharges the battery and runs ancillary systems off of the generator.
That's not to say that any of it will work, but I can kind of see his line of thought. But like Jack pointed out, he DOES need most of the HP in cruise. A car with a 300 HP engine needs between 10 and 20 HP (3-6%) to cruise at highway speed, an airplane, especially one intended to go fast needs 60-80% of the HP used for sea level takeoff. The weight of the batteries will very likely eliminate any possible efficiency gain from a battery/ice hybrid approach. What a battery plus electric fans could do is provide a short duration burst of thrust during an "engine out" landing or EFOTO.
_________________ -lance
It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.
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