BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 29 Apr 2016, 14:16

Username Protected wrote:

John Towner who owns Central Air in Kansas runs a whole fleet of 500B's with his own TKS weeping wing system. A few of his ships have over 20000hrs on them, and many are in the 15000hrs TT range. So they're tremendous workhorses if kept after.

Although I only owned the early 520 model, I can attest to how benign they are to fly. They don't bite. Landed like a big Cessna, and I could come in really slow over the numbers if I wanted to. I took mine to the Backcountry fly-in at Johnson Creek, a 5000ft MSL grass strip in Idaho. I was the only twin there. Damn thing was off in half the rwy, even though it was at 5000ft.

Or take a look when I landed it on a little dirt road in the desert:

Stuff you just can't do with that many other twins.

Adam, your YouTube videos have decimated entire afternoons of potential productivity in my world! Growing up around a busy GA airport in the early '80's I got to see a lot of these now obscure airplanes when they were in their prime, or at least closer to it. Consequently I've long harbored a desire for a fat nacelle geared Lycoming Commander, and your videos were a great way for me to live vicariously!

OP, there is nothing that says "class" in the piston twin world like a Commander. You've gotten some great advice from some knowledgeable people on here, go for it!

Username Protected · **Posted:** 29 Apr 2016, 15:09

Username Protected wrote:

John Towner who owns Central Air in Kansas runs a whole fleet of 500B's with his own TKS weeping wing system. A few of his ships have over 20000hrs on them, and many are in the 15000hrs TT range. So they're tremendous workhorses if kept after.

Although I only owned the early 520 model, I can attest to how benign they are to fly. They don't bite. Landed like a big Cessna, and I could come in really slow over the numbers if I wanted to. I took mine to the Backcountry fly-in at Johnson Creek, a 5000ft MSL grass strip in Idaho. I was the only twin there. Damn thing was off in half the rwy, even though it was at 5000ft.

Or take a look when I landed it on a little dirt road in the desert:

Stuff you just can't do with that many other twins.

Adam, your YouTube videos have decimated entire afternoons of potential productivity in my world! Growing up around a busy GA airport in the early '80's I got to see a lot of these now obscure airplanes when they were in their prime, or at least closer to it. Consequently I've long harbored a desire for a fat nacelle geared Lycoming Commander, and your videos were a great way for me to live vicariously!

OP, there is nothing that says "class" in the piston twin world like a Commander. You've gotten some great advice from some knowledgeable people on here, go for it!

Username Protected · **Posted:** 29 Apr 2016, 15:40

A "new" 680FP owner?!? Wow, that is a brave man. I can't imagine that thing would be easy to keep in decent nick these days. And I'm sure they are attention getters.

I'd never be brave enough to actually write the check, so I'll just watch your videos again!

Username Protected · **Posted:** 29 Apr 2016, 15:47

Username Protected wrote:

A "new" 680FP owner?!? Wow, that is a brave man. I can't imagine that thing would be easy to keep in decent nick these days. And I'm sure they are attention getters.

I'd never be brave enough to actually write the check, so I'll just watch your videos again!

He is a brave man. He's spent a lot of money with chump mechanics that didn't know what they were doing with major headaches to follow. Think he's over the hump now. She flies (kinda)…

Username Protected · **Posted:** 29 Apr 2016, 15:54

Username Protected wrote:

I noticed this myself at my airport. With the 520, people stopped by all the time and chatted. With the Aerostar, nobody stopped and chatted.

Anyone that walks by an aerostar without at least drooling on it is crazy. I will always remember seeing my first one. I pulled up to get gas at the KSBP self serve and there was this red rocketship-looking twin I had never seen before. Much googling was done that evening...

As for the commander, my dad and grandfather owned tons of planes over the course of owning their business, and had access to lots of different types. Their personal travel machine was always a 500B. Some of my best childhood memories are of riding in commanders... Being a highwing fan, I think they are some of the most beautiful twins out there, and they are definitely one of the most comfortable in the class.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 29 Apr 2016, 21:33

Username Protected wrote:

I am researching my next plane. It will be a piston twin. I have done my soul searching on the single vs twin debate.

I think I have found the perfect family traveling plane in the Twin Commander!

I ruled out the 55's for easy of entry and loading. I am willing to give up some cruise performance for comfort. The 58's are very nice and I am considering them as well. I did ask about the 58 vs commander on an old thread in the twins forum.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=114665&view=unread#unread

I am falling in love with the rugged/short field performance of the 5oo series. I do make a lot of hunting and work trips. SO carrying a load is important.

I would really like to hear some comments pros and cons from this great community. It is very hard to find pilots that have any first hand experience with the twin commanders. Thanks!

Ben,
I got the bug and then the dream, as well.
I initially fantasized about the MU-2, but noticed Turbo Commanders and began educating myself via all the usual sources (TAP, Controller, networking, etc).
Thanks largely to Bruce Byerly's generous advice and expertise, I realized a turboprop was beyond our family capability, but a piston 500 was the heart of the envelope. I began to see I was looking for a good airframe, but the perfect airframe would be a diamond in the rough.
After about a year of looking around, an unexpected set of events (personal and aviation) pointed me to a nice Shrike that needed a little bit of love, but was potentially perfect for my needs. Along with the input of Bruce Byerly, truly an Ambassador for the Commander world, I had the great fortune to speak with a few other key players in the sphere of Shrikes along the way. They included Jim Metzger, a leader and fan of older/classic "bathtub" nacelle airplanes and several members of the Commander Aero organization. Then, the incredible Bill Leff joined the chorus of fan/experts who were so kind with their help and encouragement.
Ultimately, I purchased a Shrike that had lived in the desert, but would be a great platform for refurbishing.
I have that aircraft in the later stages of a major overhaul project, which included a number of upgrades.
Without the minutiae, the scope of work includes: Merlin 300hp normally aspirated STC, which increases the GW to 7000lbs, total gear overhaul, zero time props (required for 2700rpm STC), numerous overdue/necessary items from pre-purchase and ultimately, the decision to install a new panel. Long story as to why.....
Panel/avionics include JPI-960, G600, new GWX-70 radar, radalt, AOA, dual 650's, gutting wiring from CB panel to all the boxes, USB plugs, FS-210, etc.
The desire for a factory Shrike was the fact that they are zinc chromate from the factory, despite concerns noted here about wing spars. My aircraft has long range fuel, flap gap seals, Cleveland mod, etc. For an aircraft intended to live in the Southeast, I looked to Gary Gadberry for his CoolAir STC for air conditioning.
So........very excited, but a daunting project that has taken longer than I expected!

PM me if you would like more detail, as I would certainly share my experience to "pay forward" the wonderful help Bruce Byerly at Naples Jet Center, Jim Metzger, Bill Leff, the Commander Aero folks and Gary Gadberry provided me, getting to this point. If my story provides any insight, then arm yourself with input of those experts ( and others), to find your family airliner!
We wanted a family-capable aircraft, that could haul a 1000# loadout (parents, two youngsters and two retired service dog retrievers), with good range.........and had to be a twin, for night/overwater capability. The Shrike is beautiful, classic and fits the bill perfectly. The price of entry was bearable, refurbishment should be appropriate and operating costs will hopefully be similarly manageable.
Will keep you posted-

O'B

Username Protected · **Posted:** 30 Apr 2016, 18:11

I've got some time in a 500A that was converted to a shrike. It had pretty much every stc that exists. I liked the room in the plane and the handling. The problem I had with it was it was a ground loving airplane. I don't know if the engines were under propped or what but it would eat a runway. And with all the stcs the plane had a laughable useful load. I say this to say buy a Shrike. Not a 500A converted to the Shrike. I think they (the 500S) are a great machine. Most comfortable plane to sit in I've ever flown. And the right one is extremely capable. You can literally do anything with it.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 30 Apr 2016, 20:38

The 500A was really underpowered with 260 HP Continental IO-470's rather than the 290 HP Lycoming IO-540's as used in the 500B, 500U and the 500S Shrike. Colemill had a conversion for the 500A using the IO-520's similar to those used in the President 600 Baron conversion. Don't know how many were converted but I've seen them for sale for time to time. That's the only 500A that I would personally consider.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 30 Apr 2016, 22:01

Username Protected wrote:

The 500A was really underpowered with 260 HP Continental IO-470's rather than the 290 HP Lycoming IO-540's as used in the 500B, 500U and the 500S Shrike. Colemill had a conversion for the 500A using the IO-520's similar to those used in the President 600 Baron conversion. Don't know how many were converted but I've seen them for sale for time to time. That's the only 500A that I would personally consider.

That's the one I flew with the IO-520 colemills. It didn't impress me. It loved the runway. But I loved the cabin on that plane. I can't imagine flying one with the 470s. It would be a pig and a half! :bugeye:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 30 Apr 2016, 22:56

Holy moly if the Colemill conversion was a pig, I can't imagine how anemic the stock 500A must be. I always thought it looked odd with its distinguishing 2-blade Hartzell props.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 30 Apr 2016, 23:30

Username Protected wrote:

Holy moly if the Colemill conversion was a pig, I can't imagine how anemic the stock 500A must be. I always thought it looked odd with its distinguishing 2-blade Hartzell props.

I always thought the same. The stock 500A's selling point was obviously the cabin and not the climb rate or cruise speed!!!