I switched to the A36 from a V35B 10 years ago due to comfort with 3 kids. It was a great decision and has served me very well. Not one regret. Now it is just the wife and I 90% of the time. Lots of IFR. I am slowing down on business flying, now it is just getting to Florida/New Orleans/Lubbock/occasional Mexico from San Antonio as quickly, comfortably and safely as possible. I cannot quit looking at the Lancair 4P and similar 4 seat models. I am not mechanically inclined, but am happy to pay someone who is for maintenance work. Before I troll the experimental boards, I thought I would query here. It is not about saving money, it is about 165kts vs 240kts or so. What am I missing or havent thought of.

why not look at the ES or ES-P? I looked at the IV-P, and then went with the ES, had TAT do the TN kit, and wow does she scream, 215-220kts LOP no problem...with the gear down!

i don't pay the inflated insurance the IV-P is subjected to (if the underwriters are actually writing coverage for it any given year) and i don't have to explain to passengers why so many have perished in my airframe design- also take a heavy look at the W&B and CG of the IV-P when you have enough gas to actually get somewhere with reserves and try occupying those rear seats

whatever you decide, feel free to contact me directly, i dealt with all of the insurance players, the plane brokers, and repair shops when doing my research, i can save you a lot of time and effort

There has been a terrible loss record on the IV-P airframes and I've heard from more than one pilot who is more skilled and a better stick than I that they wouldn't own one.

That's enough for me, even though the airplane's performance numbers on paper are amazing...

(I won't buy an L-39 for very similar reasons. I'll rent and fly one supervised for the thrill, but too many people have snapped and done themselves in in those as well...)

If it's not about the money, then what it is about includes:

-- experimental vs certified
----------- make sure the build was solid
----------- maintenance (like any airplane, was it consistent, preventative, etc.)
----------- insurance may have some requirements for coverage initially

-- speed
----------- the Lancair is "slippery"
----------- Lancair stall speed may be higher; approaches will be faster
----------- I think the crash rate is higher in the Lancair than the Bonanza

-- maintenance
---------- like any airplane, you'll need to find someone to work on it who has some experience with this model or similar models -- they all have their quirks

-- room
---------- a Lancair won't have near as much room as the Bonanza

...and a few other considerations.

Pick which two are most important to you. Much like the signs in many businesses: "Good, Fast, Cheap; Choose any two."

That is very generous Brian. I am in Navarre frequently and would love to sit down and talk to you. I really want to go fast, that is why the IV-P. Even the propjet gets my heart beating.

Check out Sanderson's Glasair thread(S). Would one of those work?

His thread started this in my head. Would like/need 4 seats, even knowing they are practically worthless. I was close to talking turkey with Mr. Sanderson, but it wasn't quite the right time for me. It is getting closer now...

Have you sat in one?

I flew one a few weeks back and thought no way is this for me. I am 6'3" and 210lbs, sub 40 years old and in pretty good shape. I thought getting in and out had potential hazards, requiring some contortion. It got real hot, and the owner always wore a hat because of the glare, and having a hat reduces the cockpit headroom even more for me. It was cramp in the shoulder room as well for me.

I didn't like the way it felt on the ground roll, and I didn't like taking it in and out of a bouncy/bad runway that was 3,500 ft with trees and power lines on each side. And then breaking action on 5,000 ft runways was less then I would expect.

The owner loved the plane and it worked for him. It does go fast, no doubt. But for me it wouldn't work. For others, might be perfect. The Bo does just about everything I want.

For me I would rather show up 30 minutes later in style.

Try to fly one, it feels different. You might love it.

The 4P is just nearly impossible to insure with any decent coverage and I think this says a lot.
Problem is there just isn't much reasonably priced 4 seat planes past 200 knots.

There is a real gap between 185-ish knot 4-6 seaters and the next step which seems to be much larger aircraft (PA46, 414, etc).

Would adding tip tanks to your 36 give you an equivalent door to door time while providing a lot more loading options and comfort? Raw speed isn't everything.

Got tips, love them almost as much as A/C. I very much appreciate the comments.
Does insurance become reasonable with time?

insurance does not necessarily, also, there is no guarantee that underwriters will write insurance on it for any given year..literally could leave you holding the title, uninsured

if you have a lien on the aircraft, your bank may ground you if nobody will write a in-motion policy, and you'd be foolish to fly such an airplane anyways without liability in place, though i'd imagine they'd simply drop hull before dropping it all

do some research on how many IV-P accidents there have been since bought my ES in july 2013, it seems like 5-10 lives have perished in them, if not more

for my ES, with zero lancair time- the checkout was 5 hours in tail number with a CFI who had at least 25hrs in make/model, for the IV-P, it was 50hrs of dual, in tail number, and there were like 8 CFI's nationwide who qualified by insurance standards to provide that dual, and they wanted $1000 a day plus expenses (plus your time, plus the gas and wear on the airplane)

the CFI's i spoke with were real characters, and they knew they had you by the balls if insurance said you had to work with them, no fun

secondly, how are you going to sell the plane, if you find yourself needing to, given these market dynamics? is it still a deal to own something that's only valuable in your eyes?

i could go on and on and on, if you want to look at lancairs of all shapes and sizes, and have some time, you should fly up to Milan, TN (KTGC) and see Brad Simmons, he has prop jets, IV-P's, evolutions, ES, ES-P's, all under one roof, in various stages of completion from kits to full finished aircraft, he's one of the few authorized repair shops in the nation (there are three total) and is often doing repairs, upgrades, prebuys, etc

He can talk some sense into you as well, knows his stuff, PM me for anything else you need

oh and for my insurance numbers, first year with 250k hull it was $5500, zero hours in tail number, second year was $5200, third year is $3600, but a few other underwriters entered the market for Lancair ES's and dropped the prices

The IV-P with 250k hull was looking like $20-25k for the first year, estimated by the broker to be 16-18k for the next three years, if they'd write it, and you gotta go look at my comments above and add up the 50hours needed to fly the damn thing, that is quite the cost too

Why not the Columbia/Corvalis. Similar airframe, but certified. I know you give up pressurization, but you get a modern, factory built, insurable, fast, comfortable airplane.

If money isn't the issue, what about the Cessna TTx, basically a certified Lancair? (or way over the fence, TBM?)

Edit: Ooops, Ed beat me to the draw!