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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 27 Nov 2022, 21:04 
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Ugh. Such a shame. Hopefully it eventually gets figured out.

I spoke with some people trying to raise money to make a bid. It sounded like the price was less an issue as was all the Italian govt hoops one had to jump through.

Carried 9 people to Cali over the holiday. 384kts TAS at FL350 on 660lbs hour. hard to do that in any other single pilot plane in the same level of comfort.


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 27 Nov 2022, 22:06 
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Username Protected wrote:
Ugh. Such a shame. Hopefully it eventually gets figured out.

I spoke with some people trying to raise money to make a bid. It sounded like the price was less an issue as was all the Italian govt hoops one had to jump through.

Carried 9 people to Cali over the holiday. 384kts TAS at FL350 on 660lbs hour. hard to do that in any other single pilot plane in the same level of comfort.


And when you fill them seats up, that's the one time (the one time only), when they also make sense financially compared to airlines... ;) :thumbup: :dancing:

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 13:12 
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Username Protected wrote:
Carried 9 people to Cali over the holiday. 384kts TAS at FL350 on 660lbs hour. hard to do that in any other single pilot plane in the same level of comfort.


Hard to do?

You misspelled "impossible to do."

It's not the plane for me, but that cabin & speed combo is unrivaled in SP ops.

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 14:54 
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Username Protected wrote:

And when you fill them seats up, that's the one time (the one time only), when they also make sense financially compared to airlines... ;) :thumbup: :dancing:


While I don't fill the seats often, I have done it 3 times in the last year, and each time fuel cost was less than Southwest ticket equivalents. While it puts a thumb on the scale when you ignore all other costs in the calculation, I still don't know of any jet that can claim the same.

I should add, I have never actually filled the seats. 8 plus me is the max I have done. Plane has 11 total seatbelts. The belted potty is quite usable as a seat given dimensions at back of plane.


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 15:18 
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Anthony - does balance get tricky with 8? I was playing around with some hypotheticals just last week and 1500lb of people limited fuel to like 800lbs or some stupid number. Maybe if you have some kids and adults its easier to place them in a specific seat to keep from tipping the scale.


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 15:28 
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Username Protected wrote:
Anthony - does balance get tricky with 8? I was playing around with some hypotheticals just last week and 1500lb of people limited fuel to like 800lbs or some stupid number. Maybe if you have some kids and adults its easier to place them in a specific seat to keep from tipping the scale.

Good question, I've been trying to figure out whether to add any ballast to mine. I have concluded that I need some nose ballast in order to get my typical light load (me solo, or me plus my wife) to work without going out of aft CG with full fuel, but if I have a full cabin with me plus about 6 adults and a dog or two it gets a little hard to not get out of forward CG.

I have ordered wake board ballast bags...

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 15:56 
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Location: San Carlos, CA - KHWD
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Fellow P180 owners, I may need a tug, anyone have suggestions?

I have and like a Powertow SuperTow IV for the Mits, it works well, and they say it would work for the P180. So I’m inclined toward that, but thought I’d see what else folks have found that works. Contacted BestTugs, and their remote control Romeo line doesn’t accommodate dual nose wheel, and their B12 could do it but not with either the lazy Susan or the ez load options, so I’d have to use strap and winch.

Other good options?

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 16:16 
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Username Protected wrote:
Fellow P180 owners, I may need a tug, anyone have suggestions?

I have and like a Powertow SuperTow IV for the Mits, it works well, and they say it would work for the P180. So I’m inclined toward that, but thought I’d see what else folks have found that works. Contacted BestTugs, and their remote control Romeo line doesn’t accommodate dual nose wheel, and their B12 could do it but not with either the lazy Susan or the ez load options, so I’d have to use strap and winch.

Other good options?


I love the Ac Air tugs. They're built like tanks and can haul a load despite being so small. My T2 (now sold to Mark Hangen) pulled my Commander around with zero trouble. Lazy susan and can accommodate a twin wheel in the bigger models.

https://acairtechnology.com

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 18:46 
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Username Protected wrote:
Anthony - does balance get tricky with 8? I was playing around with some hypotheticals just last week and 1500lb of people limited fuel to like 800lbs or some stupid number. Maybe if you have some kids and adults its easier to place them in a specific seat to keep from tipping the scale.


Last spring I carried 9 people, all adults. Mostly 170lb guys but there was one 120lb female and one 335 male. I think I took off w 2500lbs of fuel. I had someone sit on potty seat for takeoff and I was alone in cockpit. That put me right at fwd cg. I picked everyone’s seats though. Light people were fwd.

I had lead put out in nose so with just me and full fuel I require 200lbs ballast. That’s a 50lb wakeboard back under each cockpit seat and 100lbs on cockpit step.

Play around with people on takeoff in potty seat if you have a full cabin. You put a 200lb guy in there and it moves the cg aft quite a bit. By the time you hit cruise they could sit anywhere and you would likely be in cg.

One other note is that you can run out of nose up trim with full cabins of people and most of your fuel burned off. When you click off ap the control forces will be higher than you expect and when you go to trim there is nothing left. Happened to me on final with 6 big humans in the cabin and landing with 600lbs of fuel. Sounds more dramatic than it is in practice but it definitely will get your attention. Good reason to play around with w&b and seating configs in case people move around in flight.


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 22:34 
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Aircraft: UMF3, UBF 2, P180 II
Username Protected wrote:
Fellow P180 owners, I may need a tug, anyone have suggestions?

I have and like a Powertow SuperTow IV for the Mits, it works well, and they say it would work for the P180. So I’m inclined toward that, but thought I’d see what else folks have found that works. Contacted BestTugs, and their remote control Romeo line doesn’t accommodate dual nose wheel, and their B12 could do it but not with either the lazy Susan or the ez load options, so I’d have to use strap and winch.

Other good options?


Jon,

My hangar door opens up just barely enough and I have a several degree slope. So, I was pretty sure I needed a tug with a lift to lower the tail. Best custom engineered one for me and I can't say enough about their service. Mark and his engineer worked for a couple of weeks with their cad program to build exactly what I needed. Maybe they would modify something for you.

I'm having my third Besttug delivered in the morning.

An automatic loader would be nice I suppose but it takes about 60 seconds to slide the wheel scoop under the wheel, wrap the strap around the gear post, crank it tight and I'm ready to drive. The tug itself has very precise speed control, plenty of power to push the plane uphill, is easy to use and bullet proof.

If you don't find something you like better I couldn't recommend them enough. I'm having my third Besttug delivered in the morning and getting ready to order my fourth for California.

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 28 Nov 2022, 22:43 
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Had an exciting departure from Santa Rosa today. As I pushed up the throttles for take off I got a master warning and oil pressure CAS message. Right engine had 0 (in red) for oil pressure. Immediate abort. (as an aside it's surprising in a situation like this how fast you're going - I was already past 80 and doing the engine cross check when the lights came on). Got off the runway and noticed that oil temps were both in the green and normal. Shut it down anyway, pulled onto the taxi way and we called a tech. Turns out it was an indicator malfunction. We started the engine back up and took off. On the flight home the needles stayed red which is a weird feeling.

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 29 Nov 2022, 03:15 
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Username Protected wrote:
Had an exciting departure from Santa Rosa today. As I pushed up the throttles for take off I got a master warning and oil pressure CAS message. Right engine had 0 (in red) for oil pressure. Immediate abort. (as an aside it's surprising in a situation like this how fast you're going - I was already past 80 and doing the engine cross check when the lights came on). Got off the runway and noticed that oil temps were both in the green and normal. Shut it down anyway, pulled onto the taxi way and we called a tech. Turns out it was an indicator malfunction. We started the engine back up and took off. On the flight home the needles stayed red which is a weird feeling.



While I have never had an actual engine failure, I've experienced a sensor problem, and it was freaky.
Glad it was nothing more for you.

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 29 Nov 2022, 17:06 
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Username Protected wrote:
Had an exciting departure from Santa Rosa today. As I pushed up the throttles for take off I got a master warning and oil pressure CAS message. Right engine had 0 (in red) for oil pressure. Immediate abort. (as an aside it's surprising in a situation like this how fast you're going - I was already past 80 and doing the engine cross check when the lights came on). Got off the runway and noticed that oil temps were both in the green and normal. Shut it down anyway, pulled onto the taxi way and we called a tech. Turns out it was an indicator malfunction. We started the engine back up and took off. On the flight home the needles stayed red which is a weird feeling.


Freaky. Glad it was nothing worse.

Had my left engine temp gauge drop to zero right at rotation here at KEMT one night. Thought I'd lost the engine, but all other things stayed normal and she flew straight. Got me rattled for a second. Turned out it was the cannon plug in firewall that just needed cleaning.

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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2022, 18:34 
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Is anyone using the Garmin Iridium GSR 56 system? If so is it worth it?


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 Post subject: Re: The definitive Piaggio P180 Avanti thread.
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2022, 18:44 
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Joined: 09/26/09
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I have it. It was indispensable on a flight from Mexico to US, had to divert, low fuel and needed to arrange a different landing spot with CBP. It’s been nice to have otherwise - but more of a novelty.


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