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04 Jun 2025, 00:27 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


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 Post subject: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 08:55 
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Is there an obvious reason as to why no SETPs have chutes, either factory or stc?

I would think adding a brs system to a SETP would be a great way to differentiate your product in a crowded field. A Pilatus with a BRS would be hard to beat.

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 08:57 
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Because nobody has started a company to stick one on. Costs big $$$ to get and etc and with SETP safety stats everyone probably says "why spend the money"?

I wonder how big a chute you'd need for a PC12? How much room would it take up inside? Would it make the plane look worse than it already does? :D


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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 09:03 
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its so long you'd probably need two. Essentially the chute is there for engine failures. Just about everything other scenario was a result of bad choices. The PC12 has proven that having an engine failure is rare enough that it doesn't constitute the R&D..

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 09:31 
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You could get a chute from the old NASA Gemini or Mercury program. :rock:

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 09:39 
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Username Protected wrote:
Is there an obvious reason as to why no SETPs have chutes, either factory or stc?

I would think adding a brs system to a SETP would be a great way to differentiate your product in a crowded field. A Pilatus with a BRS would be hard to beat.


The single engine turboprop field is not crowded. The big three (Caravan, TBM, PC12) are for significantly different markets. The Piper is a bit of competition perhaps but again mostly a different set of buyers.

The parachute is as much of a sales gimmick as it is a safety feature. New pilots get sold on the chute as a backup and it certainly is that. Pilots who have overcome many of the newbie whatifs and have flown succesfully without a chute are not the ones sold on needing one.

At the turbine level, I can not imagine pilots looking for the chute but I suppose the money will do the talking when the time comes.


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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 09:41 
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its so long you'd probably need two.

Nah, twice the failure rate. Too dangerous.


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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 10:55 
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Remember the JATO/RATO bottles on the Metroliners? Not sure the fed would ever let GA have these but it would be cool!

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 11:22 
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No other manufacturer added a chute to their airframes when Cirrus came out. That's been to their detriment now. Chute in small piston aircraft have proven their utility.

The Pilatus safety record is truly a shining light. It's money. I'm a Crandall convert (on single engine turbine ONLY :D ) and so I agree with his assessment on the cost.

That being said as the SF50 rolls out and if there is a 'caps save' on that airplane, I'd be curious to see how the other manufacturers respond.

The SF50 is a gamechanger in my humble opinion

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 12:07 
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The limiting factor on parachute design is speed more than weight. Loads on the parachute go up as a function of the square of the speed, IIRC.

Unless you did something like the space craft parachute system that used to put our astronauts in the Pacific Ocean, it wouldn't work. Even cruise speed deployment in a Pilatus would be difficult to design for. Descent speeds even more so.


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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 12:28 
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The limiting factor on parachute design is speed more than weight. Loads on the parachute go up as a function of the square of the speed, IIRC.

Unless you did something like the space craft parachute system that used to put our astronauts in the Pacific Ocean, it wouldn't work. Even cruise speed deployment in a Pilatus would be difficult to design for. Descent speeds even more so.


Probably not really a technical issue, just a matter of weight, as in using stronger lines. I'm pretty positive, if there was interest, BRS would have no problems designing them. Look at dragster chutes. They deploy at over 300mph without an issue. Weight would be a lot less of an issue for Pilatus. And if we're talking about protecting against engine out scenario and not structural failure (they has only been one on a Pilatus, all others have hit the ground in one piece), then slowing down is always an option before deployment. The current generation BRS have handled 180knot deployments, I don't see an issue going to 256knots. Only time you'd ever need a parachute in a Pilatus would be right after take off anyway, between 0 and 1000agl. The thing damn near glides farther than it climbs on the horizontal plane.


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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 13:00 
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its so long you'd probably need two.

Nah, twice the failure rate. Too dangerous.


The second chute would just take you to the scene of the crash.

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 14:35 
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That being said as the SF50 rolls out and if there is a 'caps save' on that airplane, I'd be curious to see how the other manufacturers respond.

The SF50 is a gamechanger in my humble opinion


It could be for a certain type of pilot. I love the parachute for single engine pistons. But I think a caps save in a jet will be a pilot error issue, getting behind the airplane. I don't see any PC12 drivers jumping ship for the jet cause of a parachute. The SF50 is essentially a fast jet powered SR22.

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 03 Dec 2014, 15:10 
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Username Protected wrote:
That being said as the SF50 rolls out and if there is a 'caps save' on that airplane, I'd be curious to see how the other manufacturers respond.

The SF50 is a gamechanger in my humble opinion


It could be for a certain type of pilot. I love the parachute for single engine pistons. But I think a caps save in a jet will be a pilot error issue, getting behind the airplane. I don't see any PC12 drivers jumping ship for the jet cause of a parachute. The SF50 is essentially a fast jet powered SR22.
I think Cirrus will be quite happy if you're correct. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2014, 07:48 
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Remember the JATO/RATO bottles on the Metroliners? Not sure the fed would ever let GA have these but it would be cool!


Can you still buy the JATO motors for Twin Bonanzas?


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 Post subject: Re: Pilatus and parachutes
PostPosted: 04 Dec 2014, 08:36 
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Username Protected wrote:
That being said as the SF50 rolls out and if there is a 'caps save' on that airplane, I'd be curious to see how the other manufacturers respond.

The SF50 is a gamechanger in my humble opinion


It could be for a certain type of pilot. I love the parachute for single engine pistons. But I think a caps save in a jet will be a pilot error issue, getting behind the airplane. I don't see any PC12 drivers jumping ship for the jet cause of a parachute. The SF50 is essentially a fast jet powered SR22.

Its not really "for" the pilot.
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