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16 Nov 2018, 05:25 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


Greenwich AeroGroup



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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2018, 17:59 
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Username Protected wrote:
I agree about the windows. Another thing I like about the Mustang is the glass. It has smaller windows than the CJs, and it's an advantage. In the flight levels you're looking to minimize the window area, not maximize.


How often do you think the Cirrus will get to 30+ or even 40k?
The jet is designed around the short flight, where you spend more time climbing and descending. It is not made for hours and hours in the flight levels.

Tim

What about ground ops? Also, you don't have to be at 40K. Once you're on top you're in the sun.
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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2018, 18:08 
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selling faster than they can make them.....

Which planes aren't sold before they are made?

Mike C.


White tails.
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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 10 Jul 2018, 19:42 
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I agree that if the windows are made out of the same material and coated the same way as the M600, flying into the sun is going to be awful. There have been a few times flying West on a summer afternoon I've been tempted to put the sun shades in at FL280 it's been so hot.

For some reason, I think the SF50 windows are coated in such a way to mitigate this. I could easily be wrong about this but it seems like a really obvious flaw to just leave uncorrected.


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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 00:06 
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White tails.

Every airplane that exits the factory is delivered to a customer.

Even if a customer goes delinquent, they find a replacement buyer before the plane hits the end of the assembly line.

No such thing as a plane "in stock".

Mike C.

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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 09:01 
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White tails.

Every airplane that exits the factory is delivered to a customer.

Even if a customer goes delinquent, they find a replacement buyer before the plane hits the end of the assembly line.

No such thing as a plane "in stock".

Mike C.


Cessna had a bunch sitting around in 2009-2010.

There have been white tail Citations that got its striping after there was a buyer. It happens.
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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 09:09 
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Cessna had a bunch sitting around in 2009-2010.

There have been white tail Citations that got its striping after there was a buyer. It happens.


They brought this M2 out for a demo. Was ready for a new owner and a paint job. I think most OEM's are going lean these days though. Build only sold units. Protects the dealers and the customers of used aircraft from losses when the extras flood the market at a discount.

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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 09:14 
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What about ground ops? Also, you don't have to be at 40K. Once you're on top you're in the sun.


Good A/C takes care of most of the issue. And from other comments online, Cirrus installed good A/C in the SF50, with multiple zones.
In addition, flying into the sun for a three or four hours is not the same as a one hour flight.
Last point, the higher you go the harsher the sun. So there is another advantage to flying lower....

Tim


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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 09:40 
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Cessna had a bunch sitting around in 2009-2010.

They were all sold before they were made, the buyers abandoned the purchase contract following the 2008 financial downturn.

Airplane makers don't make airplanes to have in inventory. At least, not intentionally.

Mike C.

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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 12:09 
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My hangar neighbor flew a SF50 that got out the door and then buyer backed out. He has an SR22 and they were trying to get him to buy it. He said in another year he will probably upgrade.

Vince


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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 17:42 
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Username Protected wrote:

Airplane makers don't make airplanes to have in inventory. At least, not intentionally.

Mike C.


Not intentionally, but they end up with them.

Intentionally was never part of the origan question or answer.

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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 21:12 
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Intentionally was never part of the origan question or answer.

"selling faster than they can make them....."

The point is that's the norm for every airplane, not an achievement of note for the SF50.

Mike C.

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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 11 Jul 2018, 21:15 
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Username Protected wrote:
Intentionally was never part of the origan question or answer.

"selling faster than they can make them....."

The point is that's the norm for every airplane, not an achievement of note for the SF50.

Mike C.

They may be sold when they leave the factory, but many planes are on the line and well towards completion when sold, otherwise the wait time would not be tolerable for many buyers. Pilatus has been doing this for years with the PC12, pick your colors and take delivery in a matter of weeks versus months.
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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 12 Jul 2018, 13:02 
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Username Protected wrote:
"selling faster than they can make them....."

The point is that's the norm for every airplane, not an achievement of note for the SF50.
The text you quoted does not say, "making them as fast as they are selling them."
Are you suggesting that the norm for every airplane is that they are unable to manufacture as many as they are selling?


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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 12 Jul 2018, 13:24 
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My hangar neighbor flew a SF50 that got out the door and then buyer backed out. He has an SR22 and they were trying to get him to buy it. He said in another year he will probably upgrade.

Vince


If they can make it (the SF50) a commercial success, more power to Cirrus. Should it result in more people (because they like SF50 for whatever personal reason) becoming pilots / owners even better. The more pilots / owners there are, the better things become for everyone IMHO.


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 Post subject: Re: Cirrus SF50
PostPosted: 12 Jul 2018, 16:58 
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Are you suggesting that the norm for every airplane is that they are unable to manufacture as many as they are selling?

The norm is that every plane made has a waiting buyer. The SF50 being delivered now are to buyers who have waited almost 10 years.

The real question is how many NEW sales have there been versus DELIVERIES in recent times.

In the time they have delivered about 50 airplanes, I doubt they have made 50 new sales.

If that is the case, then in fact, they are not selling them as fast as they are making them. As production ramps up, it will be even more likely this is the case.

The original statement was designed to elicit this impression that the product is flying off the shelves indicating some sort of grand success. In reality, folks waiting a very long time are just now getting what they purchased and there is no apparent sales bump being experienced.

Mike C.

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