BeechTalk - BT - I'm buying an RV-6 ----> yes, I am different...

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 19:57

Username Protected wrote:

Arlen, how much cheaper (%wise) do you figure the maint is vs a Bo? (i.e. annuals, misc, etc)

Chad,

I'm not sure, but I think it will be substantial.

You don't have to use certified parts and pieces in an Experimental, and you can use non-certified avionics and instruments. You can gets parts if appropriate from Home Depot or your auto parts store. The builder of an Experimental can do any and all the work and sign it off him/herself except for the "Condition Inspection" (the annual), which requires an A&P. There seems to be a lot of freedom to do what's safe and appropriate in inexpensive ways...

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:06

Arlen,

Please don't put anything from Home Depot or the auto parts store on your experimental.

Aircraft Spruce is your new best friend.

Best,

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:27

Username Protected wrote:

Arlen, how much cheaper (%wise) do you figure the maint is vs a Bo? (i.e. annuals, misc, etc)

Chad,

I'm not sure, but I think it will be substantial.

You don't have to use certified parts and pieces in an Experimental, and you can use non-certified avionics and instruments. You can gets parts if appropriate from Home Depot or your auto parts store. The builder, the new owner, or the guy from the convenience store (of an Experimental) can do any and all the work and sign it off him/herself except for the "Condition Inspection" (the annual), which requires an A&P. There seems to be a lot of freedom to do what's safe and appropriate in inexpensive ways...

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:28

Cool - I've been contemplating a similar move. My daughter has lost interest in flying with me and my wife won't fly with me unless the weather is perfect. I've spent a lot of money getting my Bo just the way I want but it's getting harder to justify when I can get an experimental and run the same or faster on less fuel and maint. And since it's usually just me and a buddy I don't need the room.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:35

Username Protected wrote:

If the builder receives a repairman's certificate for the airplane, they can also do the condition inspection.

That only applies to the builder though, if you buy a completed plane, you'll need an IA to do the condition inspection.

The reason a RV is going to be cheaper to maintain:
- it has a 4-cylinder Lycoming engine (most anyways).
- it is overall a simpler plane, no flap actuators or gearboxes to overhaul, no $1500 landing gear parts to wear out.
- wrenching on your own plane is normal for experimentals, if you are tied into the local EAA chapter there is probably going to be an IA who can do the 'inspection' part of the annual in a couple of hours if you do the prep-work.
- your entire autopilot costs less than overhauling one servo for the KFC 200.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:40

Username Protected wrote:

That only applies to the builder though, if you buy a completed plane, you'll need an IA to do the condition inspection.
.

Actually, I won't need an IA, just an A&P to sign off the Cond Inspctn.

But, yeah, a do-everything autopilot is like $1500, maybe $2500 with servos...

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:44

Arlen… will you do your own maintenance?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 20:46

Username Protected wrote:

Arlen… will you do your own maintenance?

Not much of it. I don't have the skill or time for a lot of it. My friend / A&P and others perhaps....

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 21:03

Username Protected wrote:

That only applies to the builder though, if you buy a completed plane, you'll need an IA to do the condition inspection.
.

Actually, I won't need an IA, just an A&P to sign off the Cond Inspctn.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 21:33

I was just looking at the pic of your new RV Arlen and at a glance it looks like it has the old style wheel pants. That would make sense with it being a 99 model. (First flight)

I'm bringing this up because for a couple of hundred bucks and a few hours work you can install the newer pressure recovery pants and pic up an honest 5 knots in cruise. Pretty sweet these homebuilts huh? I'm not picking the new plane apart, just letting you know there is available speed that was left on the table from the looks of it and it can be remedied for next to nothin'. Paint would be the most expensive part.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 14 Feb 2014, 21:46

Username Protected wrote:

I was just looking at the pic of your new RV Arlen and at a glance it looks like it has the old style wheel pants. That would make sense with it being a 99 model. (First flight)

I'm bringing this up because for a couple of hundred bucks and a few hours work you can install the newer pressure recovery pants and pic up an honest 5 knots in cruise. Pretty sweet these homebuilts huh? I'm not picking the new plane apart, just letting you know there is available speed that was left on the table from the looks of it and it can be remedied for next to nothin'. Paint would be the most expensive part.

Thanks! This is one thing (of probably a thousand) that I don't know about yet....and great advice. I will check into it.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Feb 2014, 02:27

Username Protected wrote:

I've known people who bought virtually new RV's from the original builder, who enjoyed building the airplane more than flying it so he sold it and bought another kit. The craftsmanship on some of those planes is superb.

There are also a couple of serial builders who make a little bit on the labor and sell completed planes.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Feb 2014, 06:58

So much misinformation.

Anyone can work on, and make modifications to an experimental, not the just the builder. There are limits, but you're unlikely to hit them. For instance, if you decide one day that you don't like the shape of your wings that Van designed and decide to stick a pair of bonanza wings on your RV, you are supposed to go through the inspection and test flight phases again.

Only an A&P (doesn't require IA) or a holder of a repair man's certificate can sign off on the "condition inspection" which is required yearly. The repair man's certificate is typically only attainable by the builder of the aircraft.

Maintenance is cheaper, but not that much if you are paying an A&P. I'd plan for half of what I spend on an A36.

Avionics upgrades are the huge advantage if you ask me. I hear rumors that Garmin is about to release a big screen version of their G3X. :dance:

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Feb 2014, 09:00

Username Protected wrote:

My name is Arlen, and I'm an airplane addict. Any of them, all of them.

I like them all (I've owned a Cessna and a couple Pipers and two Commanders and a Mooney and a Cirrus and my recent special Debonair), and I like the thrill of owning and flying different planes. I've only had one wife, but I've had a lot of airplane affairs; she forgives me every time. :thumbup:

The newest chapter in my airplane affair life is a Vans RV-6. I recently finished several hours of tailwheel work in an Aeronca Champ, finalized the RV-6 purchase, and expect its delivery in a few days. Transition training with the RV-6 guru in Florida is arranged.

Why an RV-6 now?

- I'm ready for something different again.
- In the past 3 years, 80% of my flights are solo, 18% are with one passenger, and 2% had someone in a back seat ---> I only need 2 seats.
- I've always wanted to own and fly a tailwheel airplane.
- Of all the Experimentals, the Vans fleet is the most well-known and best supported, and 8500 of them are already out there flying. Another 9000 are in production.
- I have a growing interest in learning and flying some "gentleman's" aerobatics. I have a new GoPro...

- Maintaining an Experimental can be less expensive than a certified plane, and upgrading is definitely a LOT less expensive. :clap:

- My RV-6 has a Lycoming 360 (180 hp), and it flies Bonanza speeds on 35% less fuel.
- Did I mention it has a Lycoming engine? :bow:

- It takes off in 300 feet, climbs at 2000 fpm, and stalls at 51 knots. :eek:

- It's great for short hops, but also good enough for cross-country flight.
- I don't mind being different from the crowd.

Yes, I'm a member of the Vans Air Force online forum, but BeechTalk has my passion and I won't leave, even if y'all pass a referendum to expel Experimental owners! You'll have to pry the keyboard from my cold, dead hands.. :box:

Here's my new baby, soon to be converted to N4AS (yes, I found another single digit N-number with my initials!):

Attachment:

landing.jpg

Attachment:

N905RG panel.jpg

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Yes, I now have a Corvette here in the Ford and BMW BeechTalk world!

I'm excited!

Username Protected · **Posted:** 15 Feb 2014, 09:53

Have fun Arlen

I went the other way, built an F1 Rocket, sold it (7 year build 7 year fly) then bought an F33, sold it after a year. I am finishing a Glasair IIIRG with a TIO540AE2A, it fits my profile best. It's my last airplane, plus I enjoy turning wrenches.

The journey is the fun part, so many menu selections enroute!

Best
Howard

Here is wing in shop