21 Dec 2025, 16:39 [ UTC - 5; DST ]
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die  Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 18:32 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
Post Likes: +45
Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote:
You use an example of a closed cooling gen set to prove your point. Haha classic. What I said was true, in general automotive engines are different than Marine engines.
What is your personal experience with Marine engine building? How many boat motors that move boats have you built? Or does your experience end at the mouse and keyword.
Again I ask what is your experience on the topics you pretend to know so much about?
How old are you? Show us your FAA pilot info? You went to college in 1990 but didn’t get work until 2012? Lots of questions you are bringing up. More than you are answering.
Damn it I went against my word to not post. I really tried to stay away. LOl.
Mike
You can simply refute my claim by showing us a link to a PDF with specs that are different. Why don't you do that?
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 18:45 |
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Joined: 11/19/15
Posts: 1704
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Company: Centurion LV and Eleusis
Location: Draper UT KPVU-KVNY
Aircraft: N45AF 501sp Eagle II
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Username Protected wrote:
You use an example of a closed cooling gen set to prove your point. Haha classic. What I said was true, in general automotive engines are different than Marine engines.
What is your personal experience with Marine engine building? How many boat motors that move boats have you built? Or does your experience end at the mouse and keyword.
Again I ask what is your experience on the topics you pretend to know so much about?
How old are you? Show us your FAA pilot info? You went to college in 1990 but didn’t get work until 2012? Lots of questions you are bringing up. More than you are answering.
Damn it I went against my word to not post. I really tried to stay away. LOl.
Mike
You can simply refute my claim by showing us a link to a PDF with specs that are different. Why don't you do that?
Well Chris I am stuck in AZ trying to get my Multi add on. I am on my cell phone and am not set up for a research project to prove something I already know for a fact to some know it all on the internet. Why can’t you answer my question about what experience you have in the marine industry? Is your knowledge only from the internet?
How about this, you can think what you want. I have no interest in proving you wrong. There. You win. Jack Apple. Now STFU
Mike
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 18:48 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
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Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote:
Mike
You can simply refute my claim by showing us a link to a PDF with specs that are different. Why don't you do that?
Well Chris I am stuck in AZ trying to get my Multi add on. I am on my cell phone and am not set up for a research project to prove something I already know for a fact to some know it all on the internet. Why can’t you answer my question about what experience you have in the marine industry? Is your knowledge only from the internet?
How about this, you can think what you want. I have no interest in proving you wrong. There. You win. Jack Apple. Now STFU
Mike[/quote]
No Hurry. We can wait. Take your time.
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 19:36 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
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Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote: Chris, you are good with Google, but you didn’t understand basic concepts like how thrust from a prop declines with TAS or the limitations on achievable BSFC from an Audi engine. You are clearly not the smartest man in the room you seem to think you are, certainly not in this field on this forum which has some very smart and very well educated members.
Why would anyone waste time with all your questions when you are clearly here to bash and not learn? Why don’t YOU show us the math behind your assumptions that the Raptor will be within 90% of the stated performance, and back up your inputs with reasonable evidence?
I did my back of the envelope calks a while ago, and concluded no way. I don’t need to prove to you that it won’t meet its numbers, I just need to wait for the test flights. Your envelope must be bigger than mine...  I would submit to you I have some basic understanding of "basic concepts like how thrust from a prop declines with TAS" https://ibb.co/yNmx2zBBeen a while. Might double check my work.
Last edited on 25 Oct 2019, 19:51, edited 1 time in total.
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 19:42 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
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Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote: Chris, you are good with Google, but you didn’t understand basic concepts like how thrust from a prop declines with TAS or the limitations on achievable BSFC from an Audi engine. You are clearly not the smartest man in the room you seem to think you are, certainly not in this field on this forum which has some very smart and very well educated members.
Why would anyone waste time with all your questions when you are clearly here to bash and not learn? Why don’t YOU show us the math behind your assumptions that the Raptor will be within 90% of the stated performance, and back up your inputs with reasonable evidence?
I did my back of the envelope calks a while ago, and concluded no way. I don’t need to prove to you that it won’t meet its numbers, I just need to wait for the test flights. Your envelope must be bigger than mine... I would submit to you I have some basic understanding of "basic concepts like how thrust from a prop declines with TAS" https://ibb.co/yNmx2zBBeen a while. Might double check my work.
Lighting wasn't great. Sorry about that. Hope this is a bit clearer on all accounts.
https://ibb.co/84VXZGd
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 20:06 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
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Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote: Chris, you are good with Google, but you didn’t understand basic concepts like how thrust from a prop declines with TAS or the limitations on achievable BSFC from an Audi engine. You are clearly not the smartest man in the room you seem to think you are, certainly not in this field on this forum which has some very smart and very well educated members.
Why would anyone waste time with all your questions when you are clearly here to bash and not learn? Why don’t YOU show us the math behind your assumptions that the Raptor will be within 90% of the stated performance, and back up your inputs with reasonable evidence?
I did my back of the envelope calks a while ago, and concluded no way. I don’t need to prove to you that it won’t meet its numbers, I just need to wait for the test flights. Not trying to be a smart ass man. Just making the case I may have done the work and know a bit about what I am talking about. Folks can judge freely. Opinions will vary. You questions here was a good one... " or the limitations on achievable BSFC from an Audi engine." Have been thinking about this myself... anyone had a chance to understand how many cubic feet of air are being dumped out of the turbo waste gate at standard sea level pressure and temperature at projected cruise RPM? Anyone looked up the spec for that engine to determine that... and what the implications are at projected cruise altitude might be? Think I might have at this point? Again... not trying to be a smart ass... I don't know all of the answers... but have dug in "a bit." Fly Raptor Fly!!!
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 20:13 |
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Joined: 05/01/14
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Username Protected wrote:
Your envelope must be bigger than mine...
Nope, since I earned my aerospace engineering degree from a real university, I was able to write down actual numbers and results and I didn’t need to waste space writing down formulas and definitions from a Google search.
How much brake hp will it take to move that airframe at 300 ktas at FL240-280?
How many gallons per hour will it take to produce that hp?
How much will the fuel weigh for a 3600 nm range at 300 knots? At 200 knots?
It is not particularly difficult to estimate the range of likely answers for each of these, assuming you know what you are doing.
Next, do the answers above seem realistic?
Is it likely the engine he chose will be able to produce that power with a reasonable lifespan?
Can the airframe carry the necessary weight of fuel and volume of fuel?
If you do this exercise, you will understand why people are skeptical and why no one else has built a plane with anything close to the promised performance despite obvious market demand for such a plane.
_________________
Be kinder than I am. It’s a low bar.
Flight suits = superior knowledge
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 20:27 |
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Joined: 05/01/14
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Username Protected wrote: Think I might have at this point? If you really have, I think you missed the forest for the trees. I have no idea why, but you seem to be heavily emotionally vested in the Raptor and that may be blinding you to the physical reality that stands in its way. Please tell us what you think the cruise BSFC will be +/-
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Be kinder than I am. It’s a low bar.
Flight suits = superior knowledge
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 20:42 |
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Joined: 05/11/10
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Username Protected wrote: Yeah.
But about that pilot's license and the PC-12. . . . Think global. There is a world outside of your self imposed borders. Physically as well.
So you live in the US and fly a PC-12 on a foreign pilot's license?
_________________
Stu F.
"A cynic is a man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing."
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 20:51 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
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Company: Water Cleaners
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Username Protected wrote:
Nope, since I earned my aerospace engineering degree from a real university, I was able to write down actual numbers and results and I didn’t need to waste space writing down formulas and definitions from a Google search.
How much brake hp will it take to move that airframe at 300 ktas at FL240-280?
How many gallons per hour will it take to produce that hp?
How much will the fuel weigh for a 3600 nm range at 300 knots? At 200 knots?
It is not particularly difficult to estimate the range of likely answers for each of these, assuming you know what you are doing.
Next, do the answers above seem realistic?
Is it likely the engine he chose will be able to produce that power with a reasonable lifespan?
Can the airframe carry the necessary weight of fuel and volume of fuel?
If you do this exercise, you will understand why people are skeptical and why no one else has built a plane with anything close to the promised performance despite obvious market demand for such a plane.
Back into that. Draw a polar that meets those specs for your number 1 and post it. Given your degree that should not take long. <--- Responses that will never come. Because when it does.... 2 and 3 fall like dominoes.
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 20:58 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
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Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote: Think I might have at this point? If you really have, I think you missed the forest for the trees. I have no idea why, but you seem to be heavily emotionally vested in the Raptor and that may be blinding you to the physical reality that stands in its way. Please tell us what you think the cruise BSFC will be +/-
Am I emotionally invested? Or just asking questions that adequately parry baseless claims?
Draw the polar and answer your own question. Yes? Or if not, based on that information tell us why? Or if you can't draw the necessary polar theoretically, and or do not understand the implications is that the place to start before commenting?
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 21:10 |
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Changing direction. How is the Audi Raptor going to outperform the Iv-p I owned with 350hp that weighs 1000lbs less empty. 260kts lop at reasonable temps at 15.5 gph. It goes about 1250 nm on 96 gallons with an hour of reserves. I can say that the wing loading of the Iv requires above average pilot skills. The raptor will require supreme piloting skills.
That belt drive is horrifying , any other applications this system has been successful in?
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Post subject: Re: Raptor Aircraft 5 Seat Pressurized 3,600 NM Range Die Posted: 25 Oct 2019, 21:16 |
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Joined: 10/06/19
Posts: 139
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Company: Water Cleaners
Aircraft: Pilatus PC-12 NG
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Username Protected wrote: Changing direction. How is the Audi Raptor going to outperform the Iv-p I owned with 350hp that weighs 1000lbs less empty. 260kts lop at reasonable temps at 15.5 gph. It goes about 1250 nm on 96 gallons with an hour of reserves. I can say that the wing loading of the Iv requires above average pilot skills. The raptor will require supreme piloting skills.
That belt drive is horrifying , any other applications this system has been successful in? 1.) Is the boundary level airflow velocity over the fuselage/wing root/empennage of the IV-P higher or lower than the same over the Raptor? 2.) Why? 3.) Implications to parasitic drag? 4.) Parasitic drag is what percentage of total drag? 5.) Parasitic drag increases is linearly with speed? Next.
Last edited on 25 Oct 2019, 21:30, edited 1 time in total.
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