banner
banner

14 Nov 2025, 18:50 [ UTC - 5; DST ]


Garmin International (Banner)



This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 842 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45 ... 57  Next
Username Protected Message
 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 22:50 
Offline


User avatar
 WWW  Profile




Joined: 09/02/09
Posts: 8726
Post Likes: +9456
Company: OAA
Location: Oklahoma City - PWA/Calistoga KSTS
Aircraft: UMF3, UBF 2, P180 II
Test flying the G5 is catching on at BT Dr. Jim! It's aeronautically interesting and fun!

Here is my pirep on my flight yesterday.

First the impression of the airplane. It is well built. I have read a lot of criticism about this here on BT and in this thread. I find it unwarranted. The doors fit well in the fuselage. The paint is basically flawless. The interiors are ruggedly installed I'd say. When you open the doors they are substantial. When you close them they "thunk" into place. Frankly, they are a hell of a lot better than the doors on my A36 which are somewhat flimsy and have problematic locking devices (I've owned two and had multiple door issues with each). Everything I observed about the plane is solid and exuded quality.

It was 80 degrees when we closed the doors and fired up the engine. Quiet. Then turned on the AC. Cool. Now, I've had AC in my F33A from a famous manufacturer that cost $35,000 and knocked the edge off. This AC actually works like you would expect it to in a modern car.

The front office has a lot of room with no yokes in the way. Visibility is excellent except around the A pillar which is very thick. I complained about it. Moved the seat around and it really doesn't get better. The glareshield was upholstered, not some cheesy piece of plastic. The panel is overwhelming at first. It's like my G600 on steroids and blown way up. Lots of info here. For you button pushing haters there's lots of reason to hate it. But you'll have to admit you can't be stupid to operate it. It's complicated. But also logical. I found by the end of the flight I could find what I was looking for.

The front seats have plenty of room. You don't rub shoulders with your new best friend like in a Bonanza. Which is nice. But the seats are not comfortable. After an hour I was squirming around, wondering if I needed to gain weight and asking if it would be ok to add a piece of gel foam to my ass. I guess like a bicycle seat you get used to it but don't call it comfy.

The back seats are a helluva lot easier to get in and out of than my old F33A. Two big guys in the back and we had plenty of leg room, the seats recline and we weren't rubbing shoulders like you do with the fat lady on American. It should have a center console and does not.

Taxiing is easier than I thought it would be. Not much differential braking was required to stay on the line even with a little crosswind. By the run up area I felt comfortable. Did I mention it was quiet?

We lined up on the centerline, pushed the little toy T handle throttle forward (I HATE the throttle quadrant on my Bo- I've mentioned that many times - , wish it had verniers, but my throttle is a real one, the Cirrus feels small) and the airplane accelerates smoothing. It feels faster on the runway than the Bonanza, probably because the cowl is sloped. But we were off at 75 and climbing away as the first drops of rain hit. The airplane in the air immediately feels solid.

So, it was turbulent. The worst tornado in history was 30 minutes away. We were surrounded on 270 degrees by developing storms and building cumulous. It was warm. It was humid. Where were the bumps? They did not exist. I kept asking about it. High wing loading. A revelation. Later on an approach at 3,000 when typically I'd get bounced around it was like ripples. I think non pilots must like this.

As we climbed Jeff Sandusky the Cirrus Regional Sales Director set up the AP and was explaining stuff while we climbed. Drinking through a fire hose. We climbed 125 KIAS at a little over 1,000 FPM to 14,500 just because we could.

Then we leveled off and played with the plane. I don't know if you've read about ESP. Garmin's "exceedence correcting technology". It is A M A Z I N G. You have to work really hard to screw up. And then it fixes it. Read up. Go fly. Then tell me it's a POS. You'll be lying through your teeth. Get in the clouds. Get in a 20 degree nose up, 60 degree bank and climb til you stall, drop a wing and spiral out of the clouds to your death. In something else. Because you can't in this airplane. So, try to put it in a 20 degree nose down, full power 60 degree spiral and stay. Same thing. I rolled it from 60 left to 60 right so hard and fast we were slamming into each other in the wide, well appointed cabin. It's no big deal. I don't have the balls to treat my Bo that way.

Then we did stalls. Straight ahead power off. Banking 30 then 45 degrees power off. It just mushes. Pick up a wing with ailerons. You can fly the damned thing in a stall with your feet on the floor. So, we did power on stalls, straight ahead, 30 then 45 degrees. Won't drop a wing. Now, cross controlled it will but we had to work at it. So, I yanked and banked til I was laughing out loud. Then, I felt sick. I thought "I don't want to toss my cookies in this $724,000 airplane!". So I went to putting it in weird banks and taking my hands and fee off the controls. It just stays where you put it.

So, we put it in unusual attitudes and let it stall. The plane fixes itself. I don't know what the big deal about the blue "level" button is. You don't need it as far as I can tell. But it's there.

We tried to get the CHT's to drop too fast by pulling power and dive bombing. Rock solid. Followed by full power 20 degrees nose up climb. Rock solid. Pulled my headset off and so did Jeff and we discussed setting up an approach by talking like normal human beings. Did I mention it's quiet?

Along the way we played with the two gigantic screens. Reversionary. All that stuff. So, I asked "When you lose power how long can you run the avionics, etc. before the battery dies? (I'm thinking - I've got you now you sneaky SOB) -" Jeff say "Five hours" very matter of factly. FIVE HOURS! It has 3 freakin' batteries! Oh, and two alternators.

When I learned to fly my biplane my instructor made me land the damned thing with rudder and power. No ailerons. I may not be a sh!t hot pilot but you go try that. It's hard. But if you can and a cable breaks, or a cabane wire, you get to go home instead of heaven (you were already there - you were flying a biplane, right? But I digress). So, what happens in your Bonanza? In the Cirrus you just fly it with the trim hat because it controls the servos independently of the AP. And you get to go home.

This is impressive. There is redundancy after redundancy. In flight controls, avionics, electrical system, some other stuff I'm forgetting. Oh, like the parachute. But that's for wussies right?

No we are descending for the RNAV 35 at El Reno. The approach set up in the conventional manner. Except all that arming of the AP, flipping the GPSS switch, etc. you can forget about. Same with the ILS back to Wiley. And we're screamin' 180 knots to the FAF. Throttle back start slowing down, 150, dump flaps and in a mile we're doing 120. Right down the highway in the sky (well on the PFD. We're supposed to be looking at the screen remember?).

At the MAP we pretend we don't see the runway and decide to go around. So, it's pickle ap off, power up, pitch up, positive rate, flaps up, gear up (wait a minute.... :scratch: ), hit suspend, climb, FD on, AP on HDG on, GPSS switch up, etc. . Well, no.

At the MAP we just push that cute little power lever forward and push that little bitty "Go Around" button and the darned thing climbs to the preset altitude, goes direct to the holding fix and starts going around in circles like a confused dog just up from a nap. Seems like taking an IFR check ride in this plane would be cheating.

Well, I was having a hell of a lot of fun! Unfortunately for me the T storm had moved east of PWA and we had a chance to go home. So we did. At 2,500 feet (1,200 AGL) flying straight at a purple wall in the distance with our runway out front. Now, what do you think happened?

No, we did not get pounded all to hell!

We smoothly flew base and final. And Jeff, who I think must do this everyday, greased it on, just like...well, a Bonanza! I'm sure it's harder than it looks but it looks like it'd be fun to try.

So, I think the Cirrus is a well built, well engineered, well thought out, fast, safe, wait for it...hairy chested pilot's airplane! Dammit it's also fun to fly.

What really sucks is I'm going to have to quit making fun of it and all the Chlorox bottle loving wussies that fly it pretending it's a real airplane. 'Cause guess what? IT IS.

One last thing, because some people reading this thread may be upset. I am very attached to my Bonanza. It's a great plane. But it ain't no Cirrus. (of course a '57 Chevy ain't no S500 either. Both beautiful cars, of course, just like these airplanes, but they're a different breed of cat).

There.

Flame suit on! :pilot:


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:00 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 06/09/09
Posts: 4438
Post Likes: +3305
Aircraft: C182P, Merlin IIIC
I just watched the video on that new top model Cirrus on thier website. Wow. That is the iPlane now. It fits with what is 'happening" now in the eyes of its target purchaser. As many here have surmised, the debate in the new piston world is close to over. As I watched the video, the thought that occured to me a few minutes into it is that we will see a dejavu if they ever get a single pressurized turboprop or that jet production geared up. They have the base for market creation/capture the same way iSteve had it with his products and image.


Last edited on 21 May 2013, 23:32, edited 1 time in total.

Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:07 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 11/06/10
Posts: 12191
Post Likes: +3075
Company: Looking
Location: Outside Boston, or some hotel somewhere
Aircraft: None
Tony, Jim,

If either of you decide to get a Cirrus, get trained by my instructor. He will really show you how to get the best out of the plane, save the breaks when taxiing, grease landings.... He will also make you work for it. :D

I really wish they had the G5 two years ago and I would have hesitated on the Aerostar. The G4 was 150lbs or so short on UL for my missions at the time.

Jason,

Quickly fill out a reference form for Jim and Tony since you opened the can of worms. :D

Tim


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:18 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 10019
Post Likes: +2491
Location: Arizona (KSEZ)
We had to put up with the Mooney and Cessna guys now we are having a Cirrus love fest on BT. :pullhair:


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:19 
Offline


User avatar
 WWW  Profile




Joined: 08/30/08
Posts: 5604
Post Likes: +813
Location: KCMA
Aircraft: SR22
Funny read Tony :D

My SR22 is nowhere near that, fancy avionics!

_________________
TRUE-COURSE AVIATION INSURANCE - CA License 0G87202
alejandro@true-course.com
805.727.4510


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:26 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 12/27/08
Posts: 6058
Post Likes: +1031
Location: St Louis, MO
Aircraft: Out of airplane biz
WHY NOT?

Why can't Beech be thinking ahead, just like this, and giving us things that we didn't even know we needed?

They need to get out of their stasis.

There is no limit to what can be achieved, except those limits imposed upon ourselves.

For god's sake, think outside of the box.

_________________
User 963

There's no difference between those that refuse to learn and those that can't learn!


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:35 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 10019
Post Likes: +2491
Location: Arizona (KSEZ)
I can think of $829,000 reasons why not a Cirrus. :crazy:

I do see the appeal. It's the closest thing to flying in a car.


Last edited on 21 May 2013, 23:37, edited 1 time in total.

Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:36 
Offline


User avatar
 WWW  Profile




Joined: 09/02/09
Posts: 8726
Post Likes: +9456
Company: OAA
Location: Oklahoma City - PWA/Calistoga KSTS
Aircraft: UMF3, UBF 2, P180 II
Username Protected wrote:
We had to put up with the Mooney and Cessna guys now we are having a Cirrus love fest on BT. :pullhair:


Nah. There are just some of us, who like Shirley MacClaine, love more than one at a time!


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 21 May 2013, 23:40 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 01/16/11
Posts: 11068
Post Likes: +7097
Location: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Aircraft: PC12NG, G3Tat
Username Protected wrote:
Cirrus as a XC business plane??? Too slow, too small. I know in my business I need speed and some space. I wouldn't want to take 10hrs. flying coast to coast. I can do that on the airlines in more comfort than in a Cirrus.
I think the Cirrus is geared at the entry level personal pilot...parachute, fixed gear, glass ...Cirrus has made flying a whole lot safer and simpler. No doubt they are leap years ahead of Beech in innovation. Beech hasn't innovated anything in decades.
That said I bought my little Baron for short commutes from San Diego - LA and enjoyment. The last thing I wanted was to push buttons. So I looked at the best "hand flying" airplanes. If I'm just pushing buttons I'd rather be in the back of the airplane napping or being productive.
Their next step should be a roomy 6-place, complex, pressurized, turbine or diesel 300kts+.

Safety record does not reflect that, nice plane but no safer than a bonanza

_________________
---Rusty Shoe Keeper---


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 22 May 2013, 00:49 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 01/31/10
Posts: 13627
Post Likes: +7758
Company: 320 Fam
Aircraft: 58TC
Username Protected wrote:
We had to put up with the Mooney and Cessna guys now we are having a Cirrus love fest on BT. :pullhair:

Russ,

Beech could outsell them. They have a legacy that is impossible to match. I would hope this thread motivates them to think bigger.

I love my Bo.

_________________
Views are my own and don’t represent employers or clients
My 58TC https://tinyurl.com/mry9f8f6


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 22 May 2013, 01:10 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 01/27/13
Posts: 485
Post Likes: +187
Aircraft: SR22
Username Protected wrote:
Slightly off topic......Do any of you guys know anything about the R9 Avidyne avionics in some of the older Cirrus planes? It seems to me like a lot of bang for the buck, but there may be something bad about that system...Thanks


Just a quick post to remind myself to post more if I can ever make it to the end of this thread. I have R9 and love it with one big exception. Synthetic vision is two three years late. Usability is way better than G1000. You have to use it to understand how easy it is. I think this is a big GA issue. The G1000 isn't aimed at a 70 hour per year weekend pilot. R9 is. I do ave gripes with it but they are small. If you are ever in the Atlanta area and want to see it let me know.


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 22 May 2013, 01:12 
Offline


User avatar
 Profile




Joined: 01/31/10
Posts: 13627
Post Likes: +7758
Company: 320 Fam
Aircraft: 58TC
Uh oh, the Cirrus owners are here......this has gone far enough!

:D

_________________
Views are my own and don’t represent employers or clients
My 58TC https://tinyurl.com/mry9f8f6


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 22 May 2013, 01:16 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 01/27/13
Posts: 485
Post Likes: +187
Aircraft: SR22
Username Protected wrote:
Slightly off topic......Do any of you guys know anything about the R9 Avidyne avionics in some of the older Cirrus planes? It seems to me like a lot of bang for the buck, but there may be something bad about that system...Thanks


It is a LOT of bang for the buck.. Alejandro just got one with the updated DFC-90 A/P.

You just need to also update those older GNS430s with WAAS units for full benefit!

It is sad that those same avionics never made to other airframes or the retrofit market..


Sorry if already answered. Catching up. R9 uses the DFC100 AP. it adds the ability to do vertical flight planning. For example it will automatically fly the step downs on an approach without the pilot entering altitudes. The profile is set as part of loading the approach. R9 has no Garmin stuff. Other than using a custom PS audio panel it is all Avidyne. There is a lot of info on the Avidyne website. Vectors mode and Geofil are two of my favorite features.

Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 22 May 2013, 01:22 
Offline


 Profile




Joined: 01/27/13
Posts: 485
Post Likes: +187
Aircraft: SR22
Username Protected wrote:
Cirrus was going to go with that L3 system. Then they dumped it and went all Garmin.


From a personal conversation with Alan Klapmeirer:

Alan wanted to generate competition thinking it would push avionics so he was offering L3, Avidyne, and Garmin pieces. L3 was originally in the jet. Anyway, Alan said L3 wanted it the most but understood the least and was the heaviest. Avidyne was the only company that truly understood ergonomics without Cirrus telling them what to do(why Cirrus made Garmin mod system into Perspective) and finally Garmin was the company that could deliver to a schedule. BTW, Alan's personal plane has Avidyne R9.


Top

 Post subject: Re: Cirrus is so far out in front.......
PostPosted: 22 May 2013, 01:33 
Offline



User avatar
 WWW  Profile




Joined: 06/28/09
Posts: 14424
Post Likes: +9556
Location: Walnut Creek, CA (KCCR)
Aircraft: 1962 Twin Bonanza
Image

Just sayin...

_________________
http://calipilot.com
atp/cfii


Top

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 842 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45 ... 57  Next



Postflight (Bottom Banner)

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  

Terms of Service | Forum FAQ | Contact Us

BeechTalk, LLC is the quintessential Beechcraft Owners & Pilots Group providing a forum for the discussion of technical, practical, and entertaining issues relating to all Beech aircraft. These include the Bonanza (both V-tail and straight-tail models), Baron, Debonair, Duke, Twin Bonanza, King Air, Sierra, Skipper, Sport, Sundowner, Musketeer, Travel Air, Starship, Queen Air, BeechJet, and Premier lines of airplanes, turboprops, and turbojets.

BeechTalk, LLC is not affiliated or endorsed by the Beechcraft Corporation, its subsidiaries, or affiliates. Beechcraft™, King Air™, and Travel Air™ are the registered trademarks of the Beechcraft Corporation.

Copyright© BeechTalk, LLC 2007-2025

.Wingman 85x50.png.
.kadex-85x50.jpg.
.rnp.85x50.png.
.wat-85x50.jpg.
.sierratrax-85x50.png.
.ABS-85x100.jpg.
.tat-85x100.png.
.bpt-85x50-2019-07-27.jpg.
.pdi-85x50.jpg.
.jetacq-85x50.jpg.
.aviationdesigndouble.jpg.
.stanmusikame-85x50.jpg.
.AAI.jpg.
.saint-85x50.jpg.
.gallagher_85x50.jpg.
.BT Ad.png.
.suttoncreativ85x50.jpg.
.AeroMach85x100.png.
.airmart-85x150.png.
.jandsaviation-85x50.jpg.
.sarasota.png.
.blackhawk-85x100-2019-09-25.jpg.
.tempest.jpg.
.boomerang-85x50-2023-12-17.png.
.concorde.jpg.
.mcfarlane-85x50.png.
.v2x.85x100.png.
.headsetsetc_Small_85x50.jpg.
.daytona.jpg.
.temple-85x100-2015-02-23.jpg.
.LogAirLower85x50.png.
.performanceaero-85x50.jpg.
.CiESVer2.jpg.
.camguard.jpg.
.aerox_85x100.png.
.garmin-85x200-2021-11-22.jpg.
.Elite-85x50.png.
.KingAirMaint85_50.png.
.shortnnumbers-85x100.png.
.traceaviation-85x150.png.
.bullardaviation-85x50-2.jpg.
.midwest2.jpg.
.Plane AC Tile.png.
.8flight logo.jpeg.
.b-kool-85x50.png.
.Latitude.jpg.
.ssv-85x50-2023-12-17.jpg.
.Aircraft Associates.85x50.png.
.blackwell-85x50.png.
.kingairnation-85x50.png.
.Wentworth_85x100.JPG.
.ocraviation-85x50.png.
.holymicro-85x50.jpg.
.geebee-85x50.jpg.
.puremedical-85x200.jpg.
.dbm.jpg.
.KalAir_Black.jpg.
.planelogix-85x100-2015-04-15.jpg.
.SCA.jpg.
.MountainAirframe.jpg.