Sorry Mike, the upper end of your numbers are way off base. Factory reman from Continental is mid $50's and no charge for a cracked case.

Robert

On the airpower.com web site, GTSIO-520L was $59,707 without shipping, exhaust, R&R.

On RAM's web site, GTSIO-520L overhauled and installed is $78,097. Includes some exhaust, R&R.

If you can do a factory reman for under $70K all in, I would be impressed.

Mike C.

Comparing a $250k-$600k turbine to a 421 is apples to oranges.
With a 421 you get 680-800 lbs of external luggage, 500 lbs of internal luggage, 8 seats, a lav, and 1,000 mile range (not all at the same time obviously). To get all of this in a turbine you're going to spend significantly more than $600k.

Sounds like an MU2 long body or Marquise.

While it doesn't have external baggage, it has a cavernous baggage area just at the entry door which means all your luggage stays pressurized and warm. The 421 might win on total baggage volume and weight, but I rarely doubt there is a mission it can do that the Marquise cannot.

And you get to do it at 280 knots instead of 210.

Good one can be had for around $600K (the photo was from such an example).

Mike C.

Plenty of Garret Turboprops that will do that mission for well under $600K

800 lbs external luggage - that's all unheated and unpressurized. Agree not many planes will do that but that's something of a niche requirement

500 lbs of internal luggage - not a problem on an MU2, merlin or TurboCommander

8 seats - ever tried to do a W&B with anything but really little kids in the back seats? Very hard to get 8 people in a 421. That said, you can get 8 in MU2, merlin or TurboCommander also

Lav - check (except short body MU2 generally)

1000nm - check

Adam, my friend, you may be King Tut......

You're right, it is a rare niche, most will never use that kind of baggage capacity, but we do!
In the below pic the F150 bed (short bed) and back seat were completely full of luggage, plastic totes, and coolers. The Sequoia was full of people and more luggage. Unfortunately I don't have a pic of the luggage beside the plane.

Just sold:

http://air1st.com/aircraft-sales/90-198 ... n42af.html

G600, below mid time engines, was voted queen of fleet in 2011, so must have pretty good cosmetics even now 5 years later. Photos look good.

425 and 441 have roughly the same nose baggage as the 421, but they do lack the wing lockers.


I bet the Marquise handles this fine.

I've put an enormous amount of baggage in my short body MU2 (which seems unlikely at first glance) and the long body can hold quite a bit more.

Mike C.

A fellow BT member is under contract on said plane. I have seen it. It's nicer than any 421 at fair price!

The asking price was $695k. Why are we comparing that purchase to a 421? I guess there are a few, but most 421Cs are well south of that.

Because this claim was made:

"To get all of this in a turbine you're going to spend significantly more than $600k."

Mike C.

The 331s are either 1800hrHSI/5400 overhaul or 2500HSI/5000 overhaul. (With some 3500/7000 engines floating around). So even a "high time" 331 could easily be 400 SHSI/4000SMOH ... and have 1400 hours left

Glass panel ... nice but hardly required. The OEM panels on turbine aircraft were and remain solid stuff

No anomalies - yep. Hard to have much hiding given the fairly broad scope Mfr inspection schedule that is mandatory for turbine twins

Here are the raw ballpark hourly numbers based on the unlikely assumption that the GTSIO makes it to TBO without some jugs and other accessories.
GTSIO: 1600 hrs, 150K for 2 RAM OH engines= $93.75/HR
TPE-331 -10: 5000 hrs(2500 HSI):
$400,000 OH, $50,000 HSI: $450,000= $90/hr

Fuel is more or less a wash with lower Jet-A prices and faster TP speeds

Which is the same conclusion I came to back in 2012, when I decided to buy the Merlin and skip the piston twin step.

I can't find multiple examples of nice turbo props that match or exceed the 421 for my needs (potty/people space/baggage space/modern panel are my top four) at a price point under $1m.
No, 695k is not significantly higher than 600k, but I don't believe that deal is the norm. Furthermore, it's an MU2...and I'm not sure where I'm at with that. (Please don't wreck this thread with responses to that single statement, I've read ALL the other threads on MU2's)

To clarify the modern panel, excluding a fun airplane like a Decathlon/Pitts/Cub, I'm not interested in owning an airplane without a glass cockpit, which includes PFD, MFD, weather, active traffic, multiple WAAS GPS's, and flat panel engine monitoring. The first half of my flying life was with a six pack and wonky egt/cht gauges, the second half with glass. I have no intention of going back. YMMV