Not sure the rental equipment works on a jet. They usually hang an antenna out the storm window. In a jet you would have to install a fixed antenna at a minimum.

Damn, this is the coolest thread.

I love watching this retrofit progress.

Living vicariously through you Alex!

This is what I have found out and what the Cessna guys explained to me.

There is a way to use temporary rental equipment on a jet, and there are outfits that help you prepare for such a trip (e.g. an export flight to Europe). If it is an ongoing thing, it makes sense to invest in making it a permanent setup and even owning the equipment - not my case.

For Part 91 overwater operations as per Sec. 91.511 — Communication and navigation equipment for overwater operations - among other things, an HF transmitter and receiver is required. The FAA is very specific in terms of Lat/Lon what overwater operations mean. After looking this over, it looks like it is outside of any needs I would have.

Equipment-wise, nobody makes these boxes anymore, but there is enough gear out there to go around if needed, as well as people that support it. Having said that, this is old technology and with new communications options becoming available (Iridium/Satcom) it is only a matter of time before HF requirements are revised.

It's all an educational experience!

Thanks for the input Forrest - that's what I'm told, but I also found out that I can rent the equipment if I ever needed to. Since I don't foresee flying to areas which require it often (or possibly ever), I prefer the reduced weight and complexity than being prepared for maybe someday needing obsolete equipment.

On the HF provisions, that's what Cessna is suggesting - I think I'll take the advice of more knowledgable folks like yourself. As for ADF, don't know about Canada or the Caribbean, but Mexico does not have a single NDB approach left that I know of. They sure love those DME arcs though! If I keep one ADF, it maybe for resale purpose only.

Someday it will be CPDLC.

I don't expect HF requirements over the Atlantic to be revised anytime in the foreseeable future (next 10 years). They have enough of a challenge getting ADS-B implemented. No country wants to spend money to change the ground based systems.

On the HF provisions, that's what Cessna is suggesting - I think I'll take the advice of more knowledgable folks like yourself. As for ADF, don't know about Canada or the Caribbean, but Mexico does not have a single NDB approach left that I know of. They sure love those DME arcs though! If I keep one ADF, it maybe for resale purpose only.

Thanks Allen - good advice.

With the G1000 I would think the ADF is just another LRU. So if the ADF antenna runs into the nose where I assume the LRU's will be installed then wiring in the ADF LRU if you or a future buyer wants it should be fairly low cost.

I would pose that question to your Cessna installers if you drop the ADF LRU. It is much easier putting the antenna and power wiring and any other wiring now as provisions for an ADF.

There are VHF routes across the Atlantic if you fly high enough (which would be the case for a jet). See:

http://xpda.com/flyingtoeurope/#mozTocId476241

14 CFR 91.511(f)(2) suggests you can fly without HF if you are out of VHF range no more than 30 minutes.

(f) ... a person may operate in ... the Atlantic Ocean... when:
...
(2) Flight conditions and the aircraft’s capabilities are such that no more than a 30-minute gap in two-way radio very high frequency communications is expected to exist.

Seems like it would be cheaper to fly a VHF route than get the mostly useless and often unreliable HF equipment.

A note found on another web page:

The current Transport Canada HF radio requirement is that all transatlantic flights must have HF radio except on the route CYFB-BGSF-BIKF or on the route CYYR-BGBW-BIKF above FL250.

Mike C.

Alex-

Do you ever plan to land in Greenland as part of an epic round the world flight? You'll need and ADF if you plan to shoot an approach at a place like Narsarsuaq. (Pretty far corner case, I know...) Same goes for HF too...


Also the GTS825 is the updated version of the 820 (I think they got rid of the remote amplifier box). I'd be curious why they aren't using that one (price is about the same I think)

Provisioning for the GSR56/Iridium shouldn't be all that costly (relatively speaking)- so since things are torn apart anyhow, provision for it now, so you can make the decision down the road to spend the rest of the money when it is fully supported.

I have the GSR56 in the 310. It's great although i don't use it for weather. It was about $8k installed. That said, I wonder if there is an STC for it in the CJ? No 337's I assume in the CJ.

I have the GSR56 in the 310. It's great although i don't use it for weather. It was about $8k installed. That said, I wonder if there is an STC for it in the CJ? No 337's I assume in the CJ.

Thanks Mike - that is a good option in case someone some day wants to jump the pond. I don't think I will, but its good to have in the back of my mind.

Thanks Mike - that is a good option in case someone some day wants to jump the pond. I don't think I will, but its good to have in the back of my mind.