BeechTalk - BT

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 15:35

Username Protected wrote:

Probably confusing, but I will give an example similar to one that I get from time to time. Say your flight plan is present position to GLEEK then GLOCK then Destination. GLEEK is 17 miles to GLOCK, but ATC wants you to be at 13,000 feet 25 nm from GLOCK. So you try to insert an along track waypoint GLOCK - 25. The computer will not accept that, and it won't tell you why it won't. Well it is because that ATK offset it is before GLEEK. The easiest answer that I have found to that is to do the math, and realize that since GLEEK is 17 nm from GLOCK, use GLEEK as your ATK waypoint, and insert GLEEK - 8 nm. Easy solution, but maybe not easy the first time you get it wondering WTH. I am not sure why ATC does stuff like that, but they do. I have had that probably 2 or 3 times coming into my home drome, obviously with different waypoints, and some scattered times elsewhere. Have also had it when ATC starts modifying STARS on their own, to get you below faster traffic.

On other Garmin products, if you VNAV to GLOCK-25 it will make a waypoint for you. It sounds like you might be using two steps when Garmin provides a way to do it in one.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 17:03

Username Protected wrote:

I suggest block him. The Foe feature is amazing. Only time I see anything he says is when you guys quote him and argue with him. The same argument over and over. Let him do him and if guys fall for it that’s their business.

Mine

You are probably right about the Foe feature, and if I were to use it, you would be one of the first ones. Give it a rest, we all know you hate Chip and quite frankly, I am tired of hearing about it.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 17:28

Talk about augering in……this thread has turned into a dumpster fire.

And Chip; wings level probably had a lot to do with why that 350 crashed.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 17:55

Username Protected wrote:

I suggest block him. The Foe feature is amazing. Only time I see anything he says is when you guys quote him and argue with him. The same argument over and over. Let him do him and if guys fall for it that’s their business.

Mine

You are probably right about the Foe feature, and if I were to use it, you would be one of the first ones. Give it a rest, we all know you hate Chip and quite frankly, I am tired of hearing about it.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 17:59

Username Protected wrote:

I recommend the foe feature. It will not offend me one bit if someone blocks me. I have no agenda other than to learn and share my experiences. If people don’t want to hear what I have to say that’s totally fine. I am not here make money off anyone here.

Ironic that it’s OK for Chip to spew all the crap and waste in these threads but the guys like me that are tired of it are the problem. Haha got it.

Mike

Well, It's his thread. He started it. I think its ironic that you blocked him, yet you still feel the need to come on his thread and make juvenile comments. Start your own thread. Some of us are trying to learn without having to listen to your personal attacks.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 18:16

Username Protected wrote:

On other Garmin products, if you VNAV to GLOCK-25 it will make a waypoint for you. It sounds like you might be using two steps when Garmin provides a way to do it in one.

I have over 3000 hours in GX000 aircraft, and well over 1000 in G3000's. Pretty sure I have tried the low hanging fruit.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 18:28

Username Protected wrote:

On other Garmin products, if you VNAV to GLOCK-25 it will make a waypoint for you. It sounds like you might be using two steps when Garmin provides a way to do it in one.

I have over 3000 hours in GX000 aircraft, and well over 1000 in G3000's. Pretty sure I have tried the low hanging fruit.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 10 Nov 2023, 18:49

Username Protected wrote:

On other Garmin products, if you VNAV to GLOCK-25 it will make a waypoint for you. It sounds like you might be using two steps when Garmin provides a way to do it in one.

I have over 3000 hours in GX000 aircraft, and well over 1000 in G3000's. Pretty sure I have tried the low hanging fruit.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2023, 00:29

Username Protected wrote:

My life is so much more enjoyable since I blocked Chip. LOL.

You guys will keep arguing with Chip until the end of days and never get anywhere.

Mike C and Michael T. You guys realized Chips gig. He works for buyers only. What this means is he charges a huge fee to help someone buy a plane. Then he takes it to a shop he knows will find a ton of issues. The seller has to pay these crazy repair bills and Chip is the hero. His entire business model is on getting shops to find issues with planes that the seller has to pay for. Seller gets screwed, buyer pays huge fees, and Chip is the hero. Rinse and repeat.

So he will never understand the world of responsible maintenance on Legacy aircraft. His shops would expect the plane to be new and if it isn’t the owner needs to pay.

Chip is here for one thing only. Find more buyers to help support his business. He is not a pilot and has no value to add for guys like us. Owner operators that work hard to manage their aircraft responsible is not what Chip cares about. He wants blood and gets paid to draw it from sellers.

I suggest block him. The Foe feature is amazing. Only time I see anything he says is when you guys quote him and argue with him. The same argument over and over. Let him do him and if guys fall for it that’s their business.

Mine

Mike,

I’m sorry I’ve somehow made you an enemy, this all started because I called you out for making false statements about Duncan Aviation, you said you could provide the quote and you couldn’t. So instead of just admitting you made a mistake or there was a misunderstanding or whatever, you’ve chosen instead to attack my character. I didn’t say something and not back it up, this is on you bud, quite trying to flip and make it sound like I’m the dishonest one.

Just go back to ignoring me and I’ll ignore you.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2023, 01:17

Username Protected wrote:

On other Garmin products, if you VNAV to GLOCK-25 it will make a waypoint for you. It sounds like you might be using two steps when Garmin provides a way to do it in one.

I have over 3000 hours in GX000 aircraft, and well over 1000 in G3000's. Pretty sure I have tried the low hanging fruit.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2023, 10:47

That is just my point, about a "good" pilot just being able to hop from software platform to platform. Even different versions of the G3000 (there are several versions just in the M600), behave differently. One version to the next, our FLC went from being controlled by the wheel to being controlled by the knob next to the wheel. Some weird update for autothrottle. Every interface has low occurrence high workload occurrences that are only vetted by time in the saddle. I have never even seen that discussed in a sim course. Garmin will probably make it quietly go away with some software upgrade. But to my point, I would not want an experienced C525 "pro" pilot learning the G3000 single pilot with my in the back of an M2 ;-)

. The hardware is pretty easy. The software is where people can get in over their heads in high workload situations.

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2023, 11:33

I continue to maintain an up to date gtn750 is the best fms around. Easier than all the fully integrated garmin products. Easier than anything from Honeywell.

I have yet to see a function it doesn’t do and do better than say Proline21, fusion or g3/5000

Anyone have examples?

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2023, 11:41

Username Protected wrote:

That is just my point, about a "good" pilot just being able to hop from software platform to platform. Even different versions of the G3000 (there are several versions just in the M600), behave differently. One version to the next, our FLC went from being controlled by the wheel to being controlled by the knob next to the wheel. Some weird update for autothrottle. Every interface has low occurrence high workload occurrences that are only vetted by time in the saddle. I have never even seen that discussed in a sim course. Garmin will probably make it quietly go away with some software upgrade. But to my point, I would not want an experienced C525 "pro" pilot learning the G3000 single pilot with my in the back of an M2 ;-)

. The hardware is pretty easy. The software is where people can get in over their heads in high workload situations.

Thanks Charles your insight and expertise are appreciated! I think there’s something in the air causing people to be contentious, it seems like the triplets have created this environment where any time someone takes a position, they start making counterpoints and claiming the person who has X experience is wrong.

You are exactly right on the G3000, take the scenario I mentioned regarding Aubie, I have complete confidence in his abilities, but the insurance company can only see the numbers… I think Aubie would readily admit that being made aware of these differences causes pause. This is exactly why I referenced the Fusion King Air crash, panel didn’t cause it, but it was a distraction. Would the same result have happened in a steam gauge or G1000 airplane? Maybe. We’ll never know.

It seems to me that most insurance companies took their stand after that accident. Fusion sim training. As far as I know the PIC had no Fusion training, and if he did it wasn’t sim.

Thank you for mentioning the differences, I didn’t realize they existed in the M600 line, I assumed all G3000 were the same, and that G5000 was basically the same… not sure why I thought that when I know G1000’s are very different.

Thanks again for sharing. We all have a lot to learn!

Username Protected · **Posted:** 11 Nov 2023, 12:00

We were an early adopter to the M600. Our first M600 was so fresh that it was not even FIKI certified yet. With our experience in the Meridian and M500, our insurance company considered the M600 the same airframe as the M500. When we went to pick it up, there was no G3000 sim, there were not even any instructors with any useful M600 experience. Our salesman had a few hours in the M600, so he rode the first part of the flight back with us. We had read the G3000 book book cover to cover. We sure set some hard conservative minimums coming back. But I don't like not knowing "everything" about an airframe that I am flying. I can tell you that someone flying a Pre-Nxi M600 with G3000, can't hop into a 2024 Nxi M600 with the new FMS, auto throttles, autoland and all the other bells and whistles and fly it safely. Even though the insurance company has no idea. The first time that pilot Vrefs at 85 KIAS short final, and the autothrottle kicks in even while turned off, they going to Shat themselves. ;-)